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Thread: For SSD users

  1. #1
    Ascendant OMFG I Post Too Much
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    Default For SSD users

    I am not getting a new computer really soon, but I am wondering how SSD users use these things?

    I see 64GB for around $90 or more
    128 GB for $210ish
    and so on.

    It's basically very expensive as far as the whole dollar per GB ratio goes. I can not operate with less than 300GB... I probably could, but it would be at the cost of constantly watching the space and deleting and moving files way way more than I'd ever want to do.

    I'm curious if people with these SSDs are just basically loading the OS and I don't know what else on that drive then add in a typical 500+ GB drive for actual storage. If that's the case how does that work out? And in that scenario what do you keep on the SSD?

  2. #2
    Iksar Admin OMFG I Post Too Much Nedrom's Avatar
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    Use ssd for the os and apps and Put just data to a platter drive

    I think a lot of people don't realize how fast Ssd really are, if they did they would jump.

    Thing is I've been buying computers steadily since 486's and I've never seen such a revolutionary speed increase EVER since I put an Ssd in my aging Dell latitude and it's only running at sata1 speeds.

    Go for it man, you'll never look back.

    I put mine in a core 2 duo 1.6 ghz and it flies circles around my old work quad core system with platter drives.

    I paid $300 for my ocz vertex 1 128gb And for that much money you can't come close to the performance gains by anything not CPU memory videocard etc...


  3. #3
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    Performance boost is stellar. It makes sense since the hard drive really is the big bottleneck. Always has been really. I have Windows 7 on my SSD plus basic apps, plus a few games like WoW.

    The cost difference is significant, at least until the price/GB comes down. Mostly seen in the capacity and the controller. The Barefoot controller was top gun, now the SandForce controller is. There's a bunch of other metrics too, it gets real mathy.

    My advice, it's still a 'boutique' item. Interested? Buy the best you can afford, don't buy a slow or IDE / non-trim supporting SSD just to have one, waste of cash.

  4. #4
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    A couple months ago when I fixed someone else's laptop I had them get an ssd. There was a performance gain but there was unexpected hitch's along the way.

    The hp system recovery tool was not compatible with ssd drives (this is in a fairly current system 16months old).

    To work around this I had to also have them purchase norton ghost and a platter hd (they had a second comp also broken so wasn't wasted) so I imaged the drive and went to transfer to the ssd. Well it wouldn't transfer as the platter drive was 640gb and the ssd was 80 and dead space still takes room apparently, so I had to partition off hdd and reimage.

    Back when I researched best drive to get it was vertex 2 or don't bother.
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  5. #5
    Administrator OMFG I Post Too Much
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    once my taxes are done i am getting 2 64gig ssd's

    one to mirror my wife's OS and WoW

    and one for My OS and WoW
    Lenardo

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  6. #6
    Iksar Admin OMFG I Post Too Much Nedrom's Avatar
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    I just migrated my OCZ Vertex 128gb from my Dell D620 to my Dell XPS M1210.

    Used Acronis to backup the 160gb platter drive then put the ssd in and restored it without issue.

    Working great!

    Too bad I had to sell my D620 for parts, the video stopped working :( 4 yr old notebook.


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    grabbed 2 kingston v100 64gig ssd's for 114- until tomorrow they have a 35 dollar rebate- each-

    no 2.5" to 3.5" brackets... they come with the cloning software etc.

    gonna clone my windows 7 and wow, as well as the wife's when they arrive ~weds
    Lenardo

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  8. #8
    Iksar Admin OMFG I Post Too Much Nedrom's Avatar
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    you're gonna love it man!


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    Ascendant Ashenhand Abner Thunderheart's Avatar
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    .
    Last edited by Abner Thunderheart; 01-23-2011 at 10:28 AM. Reason: screwed up

  10. #10
    Ascendant Ashenhand Abner Thunderheart's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lenardo View Post
    grabbed 2 kingston v100 64gig ssd's for 114- until tomorrow they have a 35 dollar rebate- each-

    no 2.5" to 3.5" brackets... they come with the cloning software etc.

    gonna clone my windows 7 and wow, as well as the wife's when they arrive ~weds
    I look forward to hearing of your results.

  11. #11
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    they should be at the house today.

    will do mine first.
    Lenardo

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    Lynch Park



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    ok the weird thing is. after 3 hrs of deleting stuff and getting my hdd to 55gig...it won't clone.

    my hdd has no errors- took freaking 4 HOURS to run the chkdsk. but no errors, still no cloning.

    so i said screw it, xferd wow to the ssd and say screw it

    for my wife...

    took less time to get her down to 55 gig.

    her wow performed WORSE on the ssd. i think i know why, she had the c drive compressed so it cloned compressed so going to uncompress the cloned drive and see if that fixes the problem
    Lenardo

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  13. #13
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    SSD are AMAZING... but a couple of thoughts:

    Ned is dead on, put apps, OS and databases on the SSD, but static content like music, movies, pics, porn... etc on the platter drive in the same system.

    when installing, do not clone onto a SSD. Basically the OS really needs to recognize it is working on a SSD and that causes changes. E.G. There is no defrag on an SSD, you do not need swap space on a SSD, etc... so my experience has been, bite the bullet, just reinstall everything on the SSD.

    Frank (Rten retired).

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    ya i might to do that- fresh install on her computer saturday.
    Lenardo

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    Lynch Park



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    Iksar Admin OMFG I Post Too Much Nedrom's Avatar
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    Did you properly align the partitions? Google SSD partition alignment


  16. #16
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    Thought most SSD's nowadays come correctly aligned, and Windows 7 will correctly recognize and format SSDs as well.

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    Iksar Admin OMFG I Post Too Much Nedrom's Avatar
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    Alignment is extremely important. if its not setup right you'll lose performance.

    Here is some info to read up on the alignment:
    http://www.ocztechnologyforum.com/fo...e-working-life.

    Here is a great link on the ABC's of SSds, I realize it's OCZ, but it is basic info that works for any brand.
    http://www.ocztechnologyforum.com/fo...BC-for-OCZ-SSD

    Alignment guide:
    http://www.ocztechnologyforum.com/fo...l=1#post567558

    There is even an online tool that can detect it for you here:
    http://www.techpowerup.com/articles/other/157

    How to check alignment manually:
    http://whirlpool.net.au/wiki/checking_ssd_alignment


  18. #18
    Iksar Admin OMFG I Post Too Much Nedrom's Avatar
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    Important tidbit if you're using win 7 from the ABC's guide I linked above:

    21.
    Windows 7
    Be aware that Win 7 likes to install onto 'raw' unformatted space.
    Default, it will create a 100MiB hidden System partition with Boot/Recovery files.
    If the drive is pre-formatted, Win 7 just ignores the above.
    It installs the Boot/Recovery files directly onto the C:\ partition in a hidden Folder.
    If you have other drives attached at the same time..
    Win 7 can install the hidden partition there.. so beware!!
    Windows 7 is optimised for your OCZ SSD.
    Run Windows Experience Index (WEI) straight after Chipset/VGA Drivers.
    This is to disable De-Fragmentation and 'synch' Windows Accelerators.
    (see Section C paras 64-66 below)

    Did you run the Windows Experience update?


  19. #19
    Iksar Admin OMFG I Post Too Much Nedrom's Avatar
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    When I moved my SSD from my old laptop to my wife's I just used Acronis to backup the old platter drive to an external USB then I aligned my SSD and restored the partition to the larger drive and made sure to not erase the 100 MB partition as mentioned above.

    I then re-ran the windows assessment (experience update) and my disk perf went from 3.5 to 6.8


  20. #20
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    Found a microsoft article explaining importance of alignment:


    http://download.microsoft.com/downlo...T558_WH08.pptx


  21. #21
    Ascendant Stone Fist
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    My preference is Chaotic Good.

    Shando

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    See... I don't think you need to mess with alignment with Windows 7. It does it for you.
    Default Vista and Win 7 create aligned partitions at an offset of 1024KiB.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhidharma View Post
    See... I don't think you need to mess with alignment with Windows 7. It does it for you.
    Only for new installs. Clones don't do that for u out of box.


  24. #24
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    Ahh... I didn't clone my OS (Windows XP) when I upgraded to an SSD and Windows 7. But then again I upgraded both at once. I did a clean install on the SSD. Then I just exported my e-mail and such like that from my other drive which I still have in the system, it's just not the primary boot drive anymore.

  25. #25
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    i'm taking the SSD out of my wife's computer.

    saving it for the next computer install.

    which will be for the Wife.

    got planned it so far

    520 without a video card, will just take her's from her computer, what i am planning on doing is

    building her new computer "in secret"

    and then her birthday present

    the 64gig ssd will be installed -from scratch -new win7 build
    wow- fresh install on 64gig

    i chose

    AMD phenom 2 x4 for 134
    asus n4a88td mobo- sata6.0
    a new hdd -sata 6.0 500gig
    no video card (to build)
    8gig of ddr3 1333
    a coolermaster rc 692 case
    antec true power 650watt modular power supply

    will use an older dvd drive-
    will use her current amd/ati hd5770 video card.

    will also buy a new windows 7 install for it
    Lenardo

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  26. #26
    Ascendant Ashenhand Abner Thunderheart's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shando View Post
    My preference is Chaotic Good.

    Shando
    Bahaha.. ok I am slow I just got this.

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    I guess since I started this thread and now have an ssd the whole thing is kind of nice. With my laptop I don't have any real issue with turning it off when I am done with it because turning it back on literally takes around 20 seconds to get to desktop from hitting the power button. Unlike my Desktop PCs that I will leave on just forever it seems.

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    Iksar Admin OMFG I Post Too Much Nedrom's Avatar
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    Iksar Admin OMFG I Post Too Much Nedrom's Avatar
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    Ran crystaldisk mark on my xps m1210, core 2 duo T7600 @ 2.33 ghz, 4gb memory, x64 win7 with vertex-1 120gb:

    5 x 100 MB
    Sequential - 122.5 MB/s Read, 123.3 MB/s Write
    512k - 106.2 MB/s Read, 117.9 MB/s Write
    4k - 24.29 MB/s Read, 15.03 MB/s Write

    This notebook has only SATA-1 compatibility so my speed is essentially cut in half :( but its better than the 30-40 MB/s read/write I was getting with my 160GB 7200 rpm drive with 8mb cache.

    Anyone else have results to post?


  30. #30
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    Dell Studio 1745 Laptop Core 2 duo P8700@2.53GHz, 4GB memory, Win 7 Pro 64-bit
    Using Intel 80GB SSDSA2M

    running 64bit tool from CrystaldiskMark

    5x1000MB test

    Read Write
    Seq 257.7 81.84
    512K 201.4 46.79
    4k 18.59 22.79
    4K QD32 173.4 52.42

    I turned off my virus checker when I ran this test, and I am using the latest Intel drivers, but something seems off on the write speeds...

    Frank (Rten retired)

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    Reran the tests using the 5 x 100MB test

    Seq 254.5 85.39
    512K 197.2 85.02
    4k 21.34 26.68
    4K QD32 167.7 71.53

    Interesting variation, but the write speeds still seem slow.

    Frank (Rten retired)

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    Ascendant OMFG I Post Too Much
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    wow... That was a great idea. I decided to check this out, and started to run the test then the laptop froze and turned off and when I turned it on I get
    No bootable device -- insert boot disk and press any key


    And I am on a flight tomorrow

    After troubleshooting, and everything else the SSD is completely and utterly screwed. And since I can't take a laptop that won't boot up on a plane I won't be able to take it and at the hotel I am staying at have another SSD sent to me, or anything like that.

    Fun times
    Last edited by ryum; 02-12-2011 at 09:06 PM.

  33. #33
    Iksar Admin OMFG I Post Too Much Nedrom's Avatar
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    No way!!!! If so it was probably a dud anyway probably better to die now than when lots of data on it since it's new

    Check hp website for all firmware and bios updates for lappy and ssd


  34. #34
    Iksar Admin OMFG I Post Too Much Nedrom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rten View Post
    Reran the tests using the 5 x 100MB test

    Seq 254.5 85.39
    512K 197.2 85.02
    4k 21.34 26.68
    4K QD32 167.7 71.53

    Interesting variation, but the write speeds still seem slow.

    Frank (Rten retired)
    If you run crystal disk info is TRIM grayed out?


  35. #35
    Ascendant OMFG I Post Too Much
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    I went to the store and bought another laptop (that I can return if needed). HP is putting me in contact with a case manager... I am just going to tell them I don't know what they could possibly offer me that would compel me to take a replacement with how fast that last pos went bad. Also this replacement one's touch pad and buttons are million times better than that 1000+ dollar one.

    Anyone know some fun stuff I should have them offer?

  36. #36
    Iksar Admin OMFG I Post Too Much Nedrom's Avatar
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    have them offer accidental warranty coverage

    I was in at best buy tonight looking at the HP Envy line, expensive but I really like the case.

    I tried many notebooks from Asus, Acer, Samsung, Dell, Toshiba etc... and 90% of them had really crappy touchpads and hard to use touchpad buttons.

    I guess I'm too used to the XPS/Latitude and Thinkpad line where the buttons are about the best thing they got going for them.


  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rten View Post
    something seems off on the write speeds...

    Frank (Rten retired)
    btw, i was checking out specs about a year ago when i got my ocz vertex, some of the drives offer very very high reads but lower speed writes. its possible your drive is working as expected.

    Mine for instance has the same read/write speed but since my system is only sata-1 and not sata-2 my speeds are capped and held back by the chipset. I don't even think my drive is supposed to have equal read/write speeds. usually if you check the manufacturer website it should say what the specs are for expected speeds.


  38. #38
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    Good call Ned....

    From Intel's site:
    Read speeds up to 250MB/S
    Write speeds up to 70MB/S

    And I am with Ned on the better dead quickly on your laptop Ryum. It sucks, but it is a lot harder when you are out of the return policy window. Learn from it, get one you like better and move on...

    If you want to negotiate, go Zen with your negotiations. Tell them you want to return it and just get competitor X which is better. But, you are willing to listen to an offer they make that would entice you to stay with HP...

    Frank (Rten retired)

  39. #39
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    Crystal Mark crashed my PC too the first time I tried it... that's why I thought I advised against it in another thread maybe? I can't recall. However my SSD still worked afterwards. I think I had to unseat it and put it back in though... because I think that was the time that when I re-booted, I came back into Windows XP, which is what was on the boot sector of my secondary HD. So I unplugged it, went back into BIOS, changed the secondary back to primary, rebooted. Then shut down, put the SSD back in, and changed it back to primary. And never tried to run Crystal Mark again.

  40. #40
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    Well no matter what they are going have to make a hell of an offer or I'll be returning mine. In the end I might just get a platter. This one I am using now boots up in like 40 -60 max. That's still much faster then my pc, and less than 30 secs slower than the ssd. Given how I used the laptop the ssd part just didn't make all that much difference. The price for the space is crappy. When 500 gig ssd's become the norm I'll get back into it.

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