Monk Vs. Beastlord

I notice you are comparing Monks to Warriors, Rangers and Rogues. However have you thought of comparing them to Beastlords? They are after all a monk hybrid.



In light of the recent BL Pet upgrades, along with the fact that they have basically the same weapons in luclin as a Monk and their pet more than makes up for their lack of double attack and spells and so on. Also, Beastlords have the advantage of having a friend to fall back on if their hp gets beaten down. So how does a Monks DPS compare to a Beastlords? And if it is comparable... why would anyone bother making a monk now?



Morath Soulbane

"Some retired naked dark-elf"




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not only that but since BL's rely more on their pet for DPS they are less subject to the loot-chasing-frenzy than monks currently are... Sound familiar? Monks were the original ones that were not supposed to be loot chasers but how that has changed!


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[Kelwan]

Beast-Lords are a nerf waiting to happen


<span style="color:blue;">Jondalar Fairfist (http://www.magelo.com/eq_view_profile.html?num=70469)</span>

<span style="color:yellow;">Random Acts on Morell-Thule</span></p>

hmm monks are the ones waiting to get nerfed...NERFED BACK!!!!


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Funnily enough, I started a BST when the monk nerf happened and I've got to 19 so far so still pretty low.



The pet at 15 is a monster - 80hp DD proc buff means he can solo up to three blue cons at a time, at 18 I was easily taking even cons or better with almost no down time and at 22 the pet gets dual wield (I think). You can give him weapons to use.



I've found that if he is taking a beating and I'm low on mana I can step in and tank for as long as it takes for him to regen up again - and that aint long.



Pelman could NEVER have got this kind of exp. I'm now realising even more clearly how underpowered monks are and how ridiculous the nerf was.



In NK my BST was killing RED con spiders at 16 when the pet is strongest.



Pel


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Yeah I remember my 37 shaman (at the time) soloing alongside a 33 BL and the BL's rate of killing was about 3 times the shaman's on the same MOB... I was extremely impressed. (shaman went OOM after each kill and had to med). This made me realise how useless low level shamen were so I started a monk alt instead...



I also started a BL but he only got to 5 or so... maybe I should kill off my 52 monk and twink my BL with the monk's gear... (except then when the BL gets to 50 Verant will no doubt decide to nerf the class given their history)



I am certainly not calling for a BL nerf as there is way too much of that negativity going on these days. The shamans are next on the uber guild nerf hit list... <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/frown.gif ALT=":(">



forums.crgaming.com/eqbb/...hp?t=78534 (http://forums.crgaming.com/eqbb/viewtopic.php?t=78534)


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Fact is Monks still outdamage Beastlords with decent gear, if you want to be pure damage dealer then stay with Monk. At 61 the power curve may get switched with BL's getting DA but 60 or under even with pet Monks will outdamage beastlords as far as recent parses ive seen.

Soloing however, I have played BL to 30 and I can tell you, even though the BL I got is twinked, I KNOW that it solos hugely superior then my Monk did at 30 if I were to strip the BL.

(confusing sentance? it means that BL > Monk in soloing at 30 level hehe)

If all that matters is soloing on the weekends after your 40 hours as been put in, dont waste your time, Beastlords will solo easier, faster, plus in the long run your Beastlord will be more group friendly.



Your pet is such a huge boon to you, you can heal it for 300HP at level 30 which heals it roughly 2 blubs of life, while your pet doesnt take much damage, essentially making you the cleric to a warrior. <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/smile.gif ALT=":)">



Beastlords will be able to give stackable regen/mana regen and fill in with many useful buffs and slows assuming a shaman isnt present.



Plus they have many damage dealing spell lines, such as the new ice based DD's that can be cast every second and do 120 damage at the 1st tier all the way up to 450 at the third.

Im not trying to make BL seem like God because they aren't, they still need pet to do decent damage (try asking your raid leader in TOV to let you have your pets) they're H2H selection is still as gimped as Monks is, whereas Monks can get the IFS and Tstaff and blow away most BL's damage, they fizzle spells ALL THE TIME and they can easily be mitigated in a group by shaman or chanter so its not all rainbows and roses there.



Oh ya and Beastlords no wear the Fungi <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/wink.gif ALT=";)">

A lot of the people complaining seem to be angry that hey can no longer solo and they dont have the time to play their Monks going LFG and shit all the time.

For you, I feel that BL's will be the class for you. They solo very well and if you want to group you can.



For those who understand Monks true power of tanking adds with stonestance, making pull splits (even if its to set up a plate classes pull) and dealing

great damage in group settings, and soloing occasionally for amusement against low blues, then Monk is for you IMHO.



By no means do I state BL is balanced or Monk is balanced, I just say they do fit different play styles better.

If you want to solo with Monks and are too far to stop now, I have faith that Monk nerf will be fixed to either be a 'flat tax' like percentage for ALL AC levels, or a regression of the mitigation loss.

For now if the S hits the fan, and we arent given some of our defense, or at the very damn least a offensive upgrade, I am hooked up with ol' Prymaeldius <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/smile.gif ALT=":)">



Brisk Icechi 60 Grandmaster



Prymaeldius da Troll!! 30 level EQ Shelter when things went bad TM hehe

Karana


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Beastlord are in a completely different box to Monks. You might aswell be complaining about Mages or Shaman.


<hr />
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Xarnak "Death to all fanatics" Clawfist (http://www.magelo.com/eq_view_profile.html?num=266873), Iksar Monk of Xev.
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Dubious member of Hawkestone (http://pub72.ezboard.com/bhawkestone).
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"I stare, it stares back.

I long to know its feelings.

It demurs. Lunch, then."


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Lol. Really the only class that solo's worse than a monk is a rogue and a warrior, the other pure melee classes. And i'm not even sure monks solo so much better than them these days. All of the spell casting classes can do incredible stuff solo against mobs that would splatter a solo monk all over the scenery.



As for me my necro is level 12. The pets are more grunt than they used to be, the new resist system seems to make landing spells much easier.



Sure, monks deliver more raid DPS. But rogues deliver even more than monks.






Shinrai, Monk of the Lost Circle.

A proud member of Southern Armada

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Hell, my 52 sham does more DPS than my 52 monk when they duo... (sham not even casting DOTS)


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[Fopoodzo]

<blockquote>Quote:<hr> For now if the S hits the fan, and we arent given some of our defense, or at the very damn least a offensive upgrade, I am hooked up with ol' Prymaeldius <hr></blockquote>





Yep BL's are nice class, strong solo (not overpowered just strong), good for a casual gamer.





And MOST IMPORTANTLY BL's seem to be on VI improve class list, as opposed to monks which seem to be on the nerf/reduce class list. :/


</p>Edited by: <A HREF=http://pub35.ezboard.com/bmonklybusiness43508.showUserPublicProfile?gid=fop oodzo@monklybusiness43508>Fopoodzo</A> at: 10/24/02 2:10:03 am

[Ugle]

Guess I can comment since I was 2-boxing a BL (55) and Monk (54). The BL has been shelved for a Shaman who is now all the way to 46, although with all the new spells I'm thinking about playing the BL a little more often : P



(Pro-BL comments from those watching them solo in VL)

BL can solo very well in low-traffic zones. Iksar BL's get the huge AC advantages of being beautiful Lizards, things were much harder for the other races and can have decent AC. A 55 BL and his/her 55 pet will outdamage a non-Epic Monk of similar level on low-blues. BL's used to be able to CH their pets. BL's can SoW, can invis, and have some buffing ability. Wow, where do I sign up?



(below comments from being an L55 BL and no PoP spells yet)

BL's slow is 30%. Noticeable and good enough....when you are fighting stuff in the low 40's or slow hitters, so Toilers in ME are ok, Gorangas for the most part are not. 55 BL pet does a lot of damage....When you are fighting low 40's stuff in KC, take that same pet to UP, turn on others hits and wonder if you told the pet to attack. BL's can heal....for 100 health a pop. BL's can nuke....for 80 damage a pop at 55. BL's can DW....But without DA are doing less then half the damage of Monks. BL's can tank....maybe a little better then a Shaman. BL's can cast STR spells....Which pretty much any other class'es STR spells of the same level will overwrite.



My BL was played as a support class to my Monk. Once my Monk got his Epic, he outdamaged the BL and pet. Once my Shammy hit 29 he had better slows, heals, buffs, and had haste which my BL still doesn't have at 55. Pretty sad when I duoed the BL and Shammy when I was waiting to get him moved between accounts and his 29 slow overwrote the BL casting her slow at 55. Now I root-park instead of pet-mezzing adds. The places that a BL at 50+ can solo, a Shaman could have been doing at a minimum of 5 levels below where the BL can, and a well-equipped pre-nerf Monk could do at the same level. Twinking a BL to 200 WIS does less for them then getting a Monk a Fungi, T-Staff and SSHS. Outdoors given room a Necro/Druid will eat MOB's a BL couldn't even think about.



Without the CH "exploit" (as some saw it), BL's ability to solo has gone down a fair amount. I partied with a 55 BL friend of mine and now she finds it more efficient to summon new pets then to try to heal them. Until they added the mana regen line of spells, my downtime after initial prepping sucked.



BL's have some nice advantages IF you don't have a Shaman. None of the crap with taunt three times before breaking Mez, let me stick a slow and maybe a debuff if the Chanter had to mez it more then once, now the Warrior is pulling it off of the BL instead of the Chanter. BL can take a few hits, a bit more then a Shaman with the same level of slow on the MOB. BL has some nice spells IF nobody else can cast them for STA, STR, DEX. BL can emergency chain-cast heal to keep people alive till the real healers can stick one. Now with the new spells I can nuke somewhat decently (450 DD nuke at 54 is more then I would do in melee in the same amount of time). The ATK buff was a nice touch, and the Spiritual XXX line of spells stacks with almost everything.



The bottom line is, if you want to be a wuss and solo VL/SolB to L60, a BL IS a better choice. If you want to be valuable in a balanced group or multi-group situation, the Monk IS a better choice. Pre-PoP, there really wasn't enough the BL could do decently to keep my interest at 55. She was a decent companion for my Monk, but nowhere near what a Cleric/Shammy is. The pet was a huge boost to our DPS....until we got over 50 and it's effectiveness started going way down. At 55 a 30% slow and 100 point heals just didn't add enough to the mix. Maybe Epicified I would have felt different with the better slows and the better weapons. But there was nothing outstanding. Take away the pet and the BL could be out-meleed by a Cleric of the same level unless they had high-end gear.



If the only reason you are jealous of BL's is because they can solo VL better then you, you really need to get out a little more often. The new spells are very nice, almost enough to make me want to play my BL a little more. But play a BL and Monk to 55 and you'll understand why VI is working on BL's. Without the ability they had to CH their pet (which is gone now), I'd put non-PoP BL's in about the same situations Rogues were a couple years ago.....


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Nope, the reason for these posts isnt for a class nerf or jealousy.



It's because alot of ppl who played monks until the nerf are finding what fun other classes can be. I'm actually close to flogging Pel's gear to get bst a slick horse. Sheesh they kick ass.



Pel


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My main was a monk, well still kind of is. This nerf is pissing me off soo much. I started a beastlord 2 days ago and I am loving it. I miss FD and MEND badly, but damn does a pet kickass. The Beastlord seems to me to be the jack of all trades, but masters of none. (Especially with the new PoP spells)


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BSt can double attack now too with AA

(in response to description in origanal post)


<hr />My "HP/AC wrong" Magelo (http://www.magelo.com/eq_view_profile.html?num=140534)
Curscale Bloodyscales < Knights of Reverence > Xev</p>

Comparing the two classes is a totally valid thing to do, they both take up the same basic role in a group: melee dmg.



As a beastlord, I used to chase loot all over the damn place, beastlords suck hard nuts with bad weapons, (btw, they can *ONLY* use h2h weaps past 50, as h2h is the only skill that caps up to 252), the pet may soften the gap a bit, but not by much.



But luckily for monks, beastlords always end up far behind monks in all the parses i've seen. That's the way it should be.



Bst are like defensive monks with huge net hps & 3rd rate utilities, and significantly less dmg.


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My Beastlord is 46th right now, and soon to be my Main. I love my Monk but nothing is worth the angst of these nerfs.



I play to have fun, not to get slapped around.


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Xarnak "Death to all fanatics" Clawfist (http://www.magelo.com/eq_view_profile.html?num=266873), Iksar Monk of Xev.
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Dubious member of Hawkestone (http://pub72.ezboard.com/bhawkestone).
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"I stare, it stares back.

I long to know its feelings.

It demurs. Lunch, then."


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Seeing the guild pars of a Doomshade fight, guess who did the most dmg..? Beastlord with the pet, yes he outdamaged everyone of the 25 other melee (second was a paladin). He did about double dmg as me and he just has epics.



Shirdra 61 Grandmaster


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beastlords are able to raid buff well over 2000 attack and with that kind of attack with the weapons of a monk that is alot of dmg being done. then add in there pet at lvl 62 there pet is lvl 60. wait before people say there pet is lvl 60 so they can hit lvl 65 mobs. that was one of the down sides of the pet they couldn't hit as often and do monk like dmg becuse of there lower lvl against higher lvl mobs now they have taken that and thrown it out the window and made it so there pets are better then pallys sk's and many other melee classes.



there pet's lvl's need to be lowered down to around 52 and there needs to be a way for a fully raid buffed beastlord to where they can't raise there attack over 400 more then other classes couldn't even think about it.then look with PoP beastlords and bards get double attack.that alone will raise beastlords dmg with there lvl 60 pet to dmg comparable of a rogue with that kind of attack.


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