Serious Question [Archive] - Monkly Business Forums

spiritual thistlethorne

10-28-2002, 12:25 AM

I'll admit right up front, I have not played a monk beyond level 10. So that is why I am asking this question <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/smile.gif ALT=":)">

What exactly did the changes to monks do to the class. What were the effects? Have they been dramatic, and if so in what way?

I ask this purely to better understand what is going on with the monk class. Not to start a flame fest or anything of that nature. I've always liked the monks I've grouped with, and would like to know what has changed <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/smile.gif ALT=":)">

Thanks!!

 

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ssyxz

10-28-2002, 12:35 AM

In my experience, mobs that I'd solo for exp hit me about 10% more on the average. Raid level mobs used to hit me for max, and still do. Mobs that are just barely green hit me for a little more than normal, and mobs that are way green haven't changed.

10% more may not seem like much, but when the mobs are hitting for 120, 3-4 times every 2 seconds, that 36-48hp of damage adds up pretty fast.

<div style="text-align:center">Ssyxz
60 Iksar Grandmaster
Magelo (http://www.magelo.com/eq_view_profile.html?num=178226)</div>Edited by: <A HREF=http://pub35.ezboard.com/bmonklybusiness43508.showUserPublicProfile?gid=ssy xz>ssyxz</A> at: 10/27/02 8:37:55 pm

Cilraaz

10-28-2002, 02:58 AM

Personally, I've had mixed results. As an example, I was in a 4-man group in SkyFire the other day (myself, another 55 monk, 56 necro, 54 cleric) and we had to fear kite to keep the cleric from going OOM. On the otherhand, later that night, I joined a few guildies in Chardok and was taking hits (health, percentage-wise) equally as well as a 59 Ranger with aegolism.

Big picture: The change has confused me and forced me to change only some of my hunting spots.

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spiritual thistlethorne

10-28-2002, 02:59 AM

Ok, that makes sense. Was that the only change? I'm not saying that isn't an important change, just curious if that seems to be the net effect.

 

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10-28-2002, 04:53 AM

I've had mixed results too. Vellious giants beat the snot out of me in a way they never did before, but I can tank slowed chardok mobs passably well, a bit worse than previously, but within the margin of tolerance.

As mentioned it's confusing.

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10-28-2002, 05:01 AM

It seems that as a mobs ATK reaches or Exceeds a Monks AC the monk takes an exponentially higher percentage of max hits compared to previously.

E.g.

Most soloable exp mobs are doing 10% or so more damage, but reports on higher level and raid type mobs are indicating up to 80% more damage.

That means that a pos-nerf monk has effectively variably 91% to 56% of the hitpoints of a pre-nerf monk.

The reason why nerfing mitigation in this way is worse than even simply nerfing monk hps down to a caster level is the fact that this nerf effectively lowers monk hps from items and buffs too.

Personally I wouldnt have chosen a monk if they had had this few hps from the start, especially figuring in the fact that I chose a monk when they payed 33% more exp than the other pure melee and had a 14 weight limit and nearly no equipment either.

It would have been better if Verant had simply not-allowed new players to start monks and replaced them with a nerfed-monk alternative at character select. Then they could have seen how few would choose the new nerfed-monk alternative.

10-28-2002, 05:59 AM

A thought occurs to me... The warriors have proven (on the steel warrior) that mob damage is made up of two parts. A base damage and a damage interval which can be multiplied by up to 20.

Base damage is not affected by mitigation. The damage interval is. Thus mobs with a small damage base and a large interval will show the nerf on mitigation much more clearly. mobs with a large base and small interval the reverse. That may be why people are seeing such different results.

It's also quite likely that XP mobs have a small damage interval. You want to XP on a mob whose damage can be mitigated lower and doesn't tend to hit for large numbers. Thus the mitigation nerf might be minor on XP grind mobs and high on "real" and "big" mobs.

Shinrai, Monk of the Lost Circle.

A proud member of Southern Armada

Fopoodzo

10-28-2002, 06:09 AM

Yep pretty much what Kawai said.

Ironically they've made AC gear even more important for monks that pre-nerf (which may have been their intention, but it's still some what strange).

Changing something so integral to a (melee) class as mitigation really affects every aspect of that class to some degree (and it seems to vary mob to mob, and monk to monk… or perhaps monk AC to monk AC. ).

Soloing - take more damage = reduction in solo efficiency, in in some more extreme cases a monks ability to solo that mob.

Pulling - take more damage = either getting to the group/raid a lot more beat up, or in some cases not being able to pull mobs due to having your survivability reduced too much.

Grouping - well if a warrior can tank much better than a monk and still do decent damage, a rogue can do significantly better damage than a monk and tank nearly as well, and in a lot of situations one of a warrior, ranger or SK can pull as well or better than a monk = unwanted monks.

Basically throwing pure melee balance out the window and under balancing monk to several hybrids in a large number of situation.

The monk nerf, despite being very wide ranging, and perhaps not even hitting the correct target (i.e. affecting those monks with the worst gear hardest and the best gear least) isn’t the end of the world.

But VI do need to look at monks overall, and in respect to other pure melees and hybrids, in light of the reduction in monk defence.

10-28-2002, 10:29 AM

Gotta love all these posts we've been having, where the poster has a total of 1 post to their name, usually in reference to the recent nerf.

Kinda makes you wonder...

Maybe VI in disguise?

Fhen 54 monk C-T

Thrush 54 Druid

Xokz 24 Beastlord (started after the recent nerf)

Edit: sorry for the accusation Spiritual, just a gut reaction, as we have had a lot of first time posters trolling here.

Edited by: <A HREF=http://pub35.ezboard.com/bmonklybusiness43508.showUserPublicProfile?gid=thr ush123>Thrush123</A> at: 10/28/02 9:37:34 am

10-28-2002, 10:46 AM

Since the recent "nerfs"

Ive started switching out resist gear in place of AC gear. At 56 I've noticed mobs laying a considerably larger amount of damage on me even though I have a 1023ish AC. Right after the nerf I was amlost killed several times in Lguk making my usual trains there.

Note I solo'd 54 to 56 in Lguk

It was previously easy to destroy the mobs there and then train and fight any Pk foolish enough to enter "my" dungeon. After the change the trains I created would almost kill me causing me to have to zone as well. The change has also made LDC's in solb to risky for the lil exp they give. So as a solo monk most of my 56 solo exp has been nixed. There are still a few spots but It now takes twice as long to kill a mob that I could previously kill without having to FD them off. Add into that equation that I've switched to a bit more in terms of AC gear bosting my AC to the +1100 range while sacrificing my "WORTHLESS" resist gear that I've been gathering for the last YEAR.

Don't you love it when Verant makes changes to the red server game when they clearly know nothing about it.

sigh

Ironmokey

56 iksar monk

Sullon Zek

PS: WORLDS OF WARCRAFT FOR EVERYONE

Azumid

10-28-2002, 10:48 AM

I'd visit some other boards if you don't know who Spiritual is. Try the Druids board, for example..

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10-28-2002, 11:14 AM

Spiritual is from EQDruids.com (http://)

I duo with my shammy wife, we are both 54 and let me say (admittedly I have very low end equipment) the nerf has been devistating to my monk. So much so that I started an ogre warrior.

What I noticed is that even green cons can put a serious beating on me and that is with a shammy partner. It very disappointing.

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10-28-2002, 11:53 AM

A summary of the changes reported here by monks of all types seems to agree that the less well equipped the monk, the harder the hit of the nerf. The truly uber with all endgame armor who were well over the soft ac cap are virtually unaffected while the 50's with storebought goodies are taking 30% more damage, unable to solo, and having difficulty with pulls. The nerf seems to have been mistargetted and has affected the bottom 99% instead of the top 1%.

My personal experience is that playing my monk is nowhere near as fun as it once was. I "grew up" with a three person team of druid/enchie/monk which is unable to function effectively post nerf. Druid healing can no longer keep up with the damage that blue con mobs are pumping out and still leave enough time/mana for the druid to be anything other than a watered down cleric. This is a real bummer for me as it prevents me from soloing and duoing for xp. I feel that monks have been seriously ripped off by this change as they are one of three pure melee classes and yet they are no longer "good at" or "best at" anything at all. Rogues do the high damage, warriors and even paladins and rangers can tank. Hybrids get spellbooks, monks get the shaft. This seems very odd considering that the change was made in the interest of "balance".

10-28-2002, 12:04 PM

Spiritual,

Here's my attempt at a summary for non monks. The changes have most heavily impacted monks with sub-VT gear -- i.e. about 95-99% of monks in the game in the following ways:

1. Soloing/Duoing. Monks are now significantly less effective in upper levels at doing this because of increased damage taken. Mobs that could be soloed now might require significant healing and/or buffing. Your healing partner (if any) will now require KEI or more levels.

2. PvP effects. Weaker apparently.

3. Grouping. Monks can still serve as a main tank (Talking places like PoN, CT) generally only if a slower is present, and they will be expensive on mana. Unless the healers are really on the ball, monk death is a lot easier, as our damage is now spikier and more random.

4. Pulling has changed. We're a fairly good guild (first on our server to get access to Nightmare-B) though not the top. Last night doing 425 Dain for first time since nerf, our 3 best pullers all died on the pull. That hasn't happened in months. You simply can't afford to let even trash mobs on a pull bash at you in order to position mobs on a pull. In fact getting stunned/hit at all on a pull now is a dreadful idea.

What does this mean for monks?

Looking at it in the absolute worst case for monks, we are now arguably the third (or worse) best situational melee damage dealers (behind rangers and rogues). Probably the sixth or so best tanks (behind rangers, knights, wars, bards(?)). Situationally the seventh or eighth best pullers (SK's, necros, bards, druids, rangers, rogues, paladins). (SK/necro insta invis, harmshield, rapid feign, good channeling, spells; bard DA, runfast, track, super resists, plate; druid/ranger track/harmo/spells; rogues-escape; paladins DA/spells/plate).

The above is a pessimistic assessment. Naturally, in many cases we are still the best pullers, thanks mainly to instant non-interruptible feign. But in many of the planes, feign isn't all that useful due to the high level of wanderers, low hps, susceptibility to root, and reasonably wide agro radii.

The one-line summary (stolen from somewhere): Monks have become better at dying randomly.

--Katriona

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10-28-2002, 12:28 PM

Spiritual,

I played a 57, human monk with average gear. I was hunting in Chardok for the past 3 levels. I never solo and instead I used my monk to tank for a small group which consisted of a Druid and Enchanter or just Monk/Druid. I created the monk to play with my two friends. We all discussed the melee class and chose our classes well (at least that is what we thought).

Pre-nerf, with 950AC and 2200HP, I could pull and tank the entrance in Chardok. In this group, I was able to clear the entrance area and pull MOBs using FD. After clearing the entrance, the druid would have 50% mana. I could move onto the exit or possibly try the Partisan's at entrance.

Post-nerf, I died a couple of times trying to pull Partisan's. I simply took way too much damage doing FD pulling with 5 MOBs on me. Because we don't usually play with a cleric, it took 15 minutes to get a cleric to Chardok for rez. The worst part was that after clearing the entrance area, the druid would have no mana. Even the low level whelps (level 42) would force a couple of Sup Heals on me from the Druid. This just didn't happen pre-nerf.

The Druid and Enchanter can hunt better together in TheGrey without me. They get far better and quicker experience. So, I canceled my account (mostly out of frustration).

MOBs doing more damage isn't the problem for me. Its the change to the class itself. I played this monk for two years. There were assumptions that I made about the class: its abilities and its play style when I created the character. Those assumptions have changed in a huge way.

I would not have created a Monk with the current abilities of the class. I am pretty sure that I would have made a SK. They can pull, cast spells and tank well. SKs also do very good damage and can cast cool spells (it seems that Monk tanking better made up for lack of spells). We may actually have done a warrior, cleric, enchanter group and left out druid/monk.

-Fysts (average gear on a 57 monk)

spiritual thistlethorne

10-28-2002, 01:52 PM

Guys I really appreciate this info. It really helps understand the situation a bit better <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/smile.gif ALT=":)">

<blockquote>Quote:<hr> Gotta love all these posts we've been having, where the poster has a total of 1 post to their name, usually in reference to the recent nerf.

Kinda makes you wonder...

Maybe VI in disguise?

Edit: sorry for the accusation Spiritual, just a gut reaction, as we have had a lot of first time posters trolling here.<hr></blockquote>

Hehehe, no problem at all <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/smile.gif ALT=":)"> But as some said, I run EQDruids.com <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/smile.gif ALT=":)"> So I'm not some weirdo trolling around. I find that understanding what is going on with other classes, gives me a broader picture for our website <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/smile.gif ALT=":)">

 

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Spiritual Thistlethorne</a>
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(Summoning Snow Bunny Pet!)

Azumid

10-28-2002, 02:33 PM

Oh, make no mistake, I never said Spiritual wasn't weird <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/laugh.gif ALT=":lol">

Hey man, long time no see <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/smile.gif ALT=":)">

/salute

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10-28-2002, 05:11 PM

I think we got nerfed a hell of a lot more then just 10%. Try 20% more dam on ALL mobs, even those fookin light blues. Its insane. Monk simply have to bitch more. Look at the pallies, wars and druids. NO WAY would this kind of nerf been passed on to them.

Foulsbane 60 cleric Mith Marr

spiritual thistlethorne

10-29-2002, 03:27 AM

Me? Weird? <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/smile.gif ALT=":)"> That's probably being kind <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/smile.gif ALT=":)">

Hey back at you Az <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/smile.gif ALT=":)">

 

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ssyxz

10-29-2002, 12:52 PM

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>I think we got nerfed a hell of a lot more then just 10%<hr></blockquote>Then 10% is from mobs I solo for exp. Other mobs will be different, as they have different ATK ratings. Before the change, the fight would be close, but I'd win. After, there is no way I can win, I have to FD the mob off, bandage and try again. Sometimes I have to do this 3-4 times if I get a string of max hits from the mob. My exp gaining as slowed to a near halt, solo at least.

To add a little fuel to the fire, today someone was shouting "Any rogues LFG?", I responded with "There are a bunch of monks here LFG". "Monks are too gimp now, we want a rogue".

Whether or not we are "too gimp", the impression is that we are.

<div style="text-align:center">Ssyxz
60 Iksar Grandmaster
Magelo (http://www.magelo.com/eq_view_profile.html?num=178226)</div>

Fopoodzo

10-29-2002, 01:23 PM

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>To add a little fuel to the fire, today someone was shouting "Any rogues LFG?", I responded with "There are a bunch of monks here LFG". "Monks are too gimp now, we want a rogue".

Whether or not we are "too gimp", the impression is that we are.<hr></blockquote>

That's exactly the problem (grouping wise) VI have created with the mitigation nerf.

Want a tank? Get a warrior (or paladin, SK, ranger over a monk... even a rogue can do nearly as good a job)

Want a damage dealer? Get a rogue (warriors aren't so far behind monks now and some hybrids are close with more utility from spells)

If you don't absolutely, positively need a FD pulling (and most exp grinding doesn't) you don't need a monk in your group, almost any other class would be better. <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/frown.gif ALT=":(">

This would be easily fixed with a small damage table upgrade, or an avoidance upgrade (or undoing the nerf, and giving plate classes a mitigation bonus).

Blazyn

10-29-2002, 01:44 PM

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>

What exactly did the changes to monks do to the class. What were the effects? Have they been dramatic, and if so in what way?

<hr></blockquote>

My opinion and experience - strangely enough, it depends entirely on your gear. Basically, I think this nerf reduced the level of the mob you can effectively tank by several levels. Therefore, if you had uber gear and could tank high end mobs, you can still tank high end mobs. If you had middle of the road gear and could tank mobs 10 levels below you, now you can only tank low/light blues. If you had lousy gear (like me) and could only previously tank low/light blues - now you're in trouble.

This is clearly an example of a short sighted fix that:

a) Didn't solve the problem, and

b) Caused another one Verant has not acknowleged.

Sigh.

[54 Disciple] Blazyn (Human) - The Rathe

10-29-2002, 02:56 PM

Spiritual -

The change in damage mitigation hurts the lowest levels with the crappiest gear the most. I don't think it accomplished what it set out to do, which was suppposedly to keep high level monks from tanking. I'm going to keep playing my monk and hoping I get groups that still want him.

Thanks for visiting and asking what we think about the latest changes. So many others come here just to flame, gloat, or tell everyone to stop whining. Your courtesy is a refreshing change and much appreciated.

Tempur

10-29-2002, 03:14 PM

to quote a higher lvl monk i know:

"Oh, a blue...LOADING, "

"Oh, a light blue...LOADING, "

"Oh, a green...RUN! "

i believe he is lvl 58. i'm almost in agreement with his viewpoint now. the big three changes that VI has made in the last several months have basically killed my toon. the npc caster change was bad. mobs started lighting me up with ALL kinds of new spells. to make it worse, resists were changed. now not only are the npc casters tossing really neato spells my way but i'm not resisting any of em. now my mitigation gets nerfed. gee...my last haven of soloing pure melee mobs has been taken away.

this is how bad its gotten. i died to a mob that was approx 20 lvls lower than i. i was wandering around in a low lvl dungeon randomly smacking some mobs. at one point i ended up with 4 melee mobs on me. no problem, start smacking them around and happen to glance at my HP and i'm down to 2 bubs of health. WTF? so i finish off the last mob with about a bubble of hp left and start binding wounds. next thing i see is a nuke land for about 35 damage. i turn around in time for the next nuke to land. full damage nuke....LOADING.

i'm on the verge of retiring now. i don't see the point of continuing to waste time on a toon that can't even stand up to a couple of mobs that are 20 lvls lower.

<a href=http://www.magelo.com/eq_view_profile.html?num=67354>Tempur Flarin</a> - The Maniac Monk
Vitam Aeternam

You want me to pull WHAT?

10-29-2002, 03:46 PM

Tempur said it well. The changes that have affected Monks in a huge way are the caster/resists and the AC nerf or damage mitigation nerf.

1. The NPC caster change blew away FD pulling. Try pulling shammy frogs in SEB now. They stand there and blast (through walls and floors). They hit you with slow first (not a good thing for a monk since all we have left is DPS) then instill then start blasting. You can't FD pull them because they keep blasting you. Last time I pulled in SEB at exit, the average caster would dump 4 spells on me before moving to chase me back to group.

(One of the primary reasons I played a Monk was to pull MOBs in dungeons. Caster nerf blew that away. My last time in SEB the level 60, uber cleric ended up pulling while I watched and begged for heals.)

2. AC reduction change or damage mitigation nerf (recent nerf). It appears that if a MOBs attack is greater than your AC, the damage output from the MOB approaches maximum for that MOB quickly. In addition, MOBs where the ATK is greater than your AC will produce a flurry of hits on the Monk at max damage. This nerf reduces the Monk class down to one thing: DPS (which is severly affected by the caster/resist changes).

Before nerf: monks could pull, monks could tank somewaht, monks could tank in split pull situations, monk could do good melee damage, monks could solo (I personally never did this one)

After nerf(s) (caster and damage mitigation): monks can do good melee damage.

Enough posting to the boardds for me, where do I send an e-mail to verant complaining?

-Fysts (average gear on a 57 human monk)

10-29-2002, 04:17 PM

I guess this is one of those "Your mileage may vary" sort of things...

For one, when the caster changes went in, I actually started seeing MORE resists. I went to Sebilis and saw Ice Comet resist as opposed to the usual ForceShock or whatever it was that wizard mobs always used to cast. It also improved pulling because they would use 2 or 3 mana intensive spells (that I would resist) and then charge instead of casting ForceShock 45 billion times from max range. The casting range change was great too... I see it casting, all I have to do is keep running and if I get out of range, he misses the spell and comes running. I never had a problem single pulling in Seb from 47 up, and the caster change actually made it easier for me (but then I also don't use the "bring 'em all then split 'em with FD" method of pulling). And as always, I love killing casters, cause if its casting its not fighting, and then I resist it and keep on kicking his ass.

As for the defence change.. yeah, I've seen a difference, and its closed a couple of places I use to occasionally solo, but when playing with my usual partner, a cleric, it hasn't changed at all... 200 point per tick regen from Celestial Healing is still good enough, and we aren't any less mana effecient then before.

And I can still tank for my groups... I tanked Drioc (or whatever the name of the guy from the Kael bank is that drops the head for the circlet quest) the other night. Last week I pulled and add tanked in the arena. Sure, it hurt more than it would have before the change, but I can still do it.

Oh well... as the first line says.. your mileage may vary.

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10-29-2002, 06:23 PM

I don't think it accomplished what it set out to do, which was suppposedly to keep high level monks from tanking.

Please prove to me, by providing a valid link to an existing/live webpage, post, etc. that proves your theory. They most likely nerfed monks to stop them from tanking in XP groups. Not high end mobs. Why nerf high end monks if they're already taking max damage with each hit? It would be pointless.

So it must obviously be targeted at the mid-range monks who could tank better, pull better, do more damage than warriors of a similar gear and level. Now, monks are being forced to group, instead of soloing. Amazing.

Isn't that what this game is about, going out in groups and slaying the villainous foe and living to tell the tale? That's what it should be about, but instead it's turned into a gank the mob in the quickest fashion possible and get the goober loots and levels.

Can you really and truly say that solo xp'grinding is FUN? If you can, you need to turn the computer off and go get a life. High speed mobile dungeon crawling is a blast. At ALL levels. Screw camping in one spot... move around, kill things, have fun. Don't just stand up, hit auto-attack, hit mend, hit kick, over and over and over...

Come to Brell Serillis and send me a tell once you get to 20 or so. I've got a paladin that can show you a thing or two about dungeon crawling.

Katnips

10-29-2002, 06:36 PM

^^^^

Thanks for the well thought out Troll. Nothing to see here except another uninformed idiot who probably screamed just as loud when the Paladin AA Nerf was announced (but never went live even on Test); and of course is 100% right (in his own mind).

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Damudge Deeler

10-29-2002, 09:18 PM

Go back to your Druid board. LOL

JK with you.

Glad to have you interested in us monkees. Have not been to your board in a week or so, but I need that new Harmony spell.

Anyone find it yet??

<a href=http://www.magelo.com/eq_view_profile.html?num=19594> Magelo Profile </a>

spiritual thistlethorne

10-30-2002, 03:12 AM

Yep, it was found. Shadowhaven Druid Guild, on Sarlos Windwalker.

 

<a href="mailto:spiritual@eqdruids.com" style="text-decoration: none; font-weight: 700">
Spiritual Thistlethorne</a>
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EQDruids.com (http://www.eqdruids.com/)
spiritual@eqdruids.com
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(Summoning Snow Bunny Pet!)

10-30-2002, 03:22 AM

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>I don't think it accomplished what it set out to do, which was suppposedly to keep high level monks from tanking.<hr></blockquote>

This just didnt happen. High level monks, level 60 with lots of AA, were unaffected by the nerf. The nerf was cleared aimed at the majority of monks who were just trying to get along.

-Fysts (Average gear on a 57 human monk)

10-30-2002, 08:17 AM

Well I have a 52 monk with decent equipment (SoM/SoS/Fungi/SCHW)

I used to be able to powerlevel on Seafury Island in OOT where basically all I needed was toss on buffs and then sitting back, refresh DS and regen when needed. Now I have to heal atleast once every fight, sometimes twice.

And I have done this a lot, switched to AAXP when my monk dinged 52.

This is not much of a change for me, a couple of days ago my monk tanked in Akheva, with a 60 shaman slowing, and that was no problem.

But without slow, my monk is becoming worthless for me, I could have the monk tank for XP giving mobs tossing in a heal here and there, now I can solo xp far faster without the monk.

I was planning on that my monk was going to be my main in the long run, but now I just stick with my druid.

btw: Hi Spiritual

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Baron Wildroot Forestrunner - Hierophant (http://www.magelo.com/eq_view_profile.html?num=31818)

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Ceene Flurryfists - Disciple

Zcye Forestrunner - 34th Ranger

Zarina - 34th Cleric

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Rhaven Shadowblade - 29th Warrior

Dezra - 20th Enchanter

Plean - 17th Rogue

Ugok - 9th Shadow Knight

Orgill - 8th Cleric

10-30-2002, 03:21 PM

first time poster here but not a troll.

I am a druid so this is from my perspective.

I duo almost exclusively with monks.

one is 60 with 30+aa, one is 57 with no aa except run speed 3.

I notice on normal XP mobs only a little difference in my mana, what we can handle and how much down time there is.

I do notice on mobs that require a group the monk take more of a beating on pulls, and with resist changes they more frequently get nuked to death on pulls.

I dont beleive they are horribley gimped, I still greatly prefer a monk as a duo partner over a warrior. And I almost refuse to play with rogues as a general rule. Monks are my favorite melee class, and I hope verant puts the nerf bat away.

<a href="http://www.magelo.com/eq_view_profile.html?num=200406">Rhyae - 60 Druid

</a>

<a href="http://www.magelo.com/eq_view_profile.html?num=94852">Elgadol - 55 Pally

</a>

10-30-2002, 03:23 PM

cant remove posts. had to edit. pardon

<a href="http://www.magelo.com/eq_view_profile.html?num=200406">Rhyae - 60 Druid

</a>

<a href="http://www.magelo.com/eq_view_profile.html?num=94852">Elgadol - 55 Pally

</a>

Edited by: <A HREF=http://pub35.ezboard.com/bmonklybusiness43508.showUserPublicProfile?gid=elg adol>elgadol</A> at: 10/30/02 11:24:59 am

10-30-2002, 04:56 PM

Played my 45 monk for about an hour of non-stop bashing this morning.

Compare how she did against the last time I 2boxed her in DL with my cleric.

Last time at level 42 with max defence and buffed ac in the 780 range.

Fighting gnashers and ragers. Against gnashers she required 1 sup heal during the fights when she got so half health. And would require another greater heal after fight to get back to full health. Against ragers she needed 1 sup heal at half another sup heal at about 30% left on critter. Back then she was using a fb and cot.

This morning at 45 with buffed ac at 936 against gnashers and ragers. She needed 3 cel heals and 1 sup heal at half. Against ragers she needed 2 divine lights and 3 cel heals. All this while using a gorg club (12/23) and SoS (14/27). Her ac and dps are alot higher not to mention higher skills. And she still took more healing to keel the same critters after the nerf.

Granted there was no parsing. I based it on how much healing my cleric had to do to keep my monk going. Is this a simular increase in damage received as other monks are say? /shrug But since my main and primary alt are healers. I tend to look at thing from that perspective. How many heals and how much mana did I pour into someone to keep them alive. It was lot more healing post nerf than pre nerf.

Tsulyra (http://www.magelo.com/eq_view_profile.html?num=150479) Shadowhawk

Hierophant of Tunare

Second Covenant - Lanys
Jendera (http://www.magelo.com/eq_view_profile.html?num=151255) Shadowhawk
52nd rank sword mistress of Tunare

Pollyra 45 monk - Bellyra (http://www.magelo.com/eq_view_profile.html?num=293914) 54 cleric

Tempur

10-30-2002, 08:04 PM

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>Come to Brell Serillis and send me a tell once you get to 20 or so. I've got a paladin that can show you a thing or two about dungeon crawling.<hr></blockquote>

first of all i doubt you could show me jack about dungeon crawling. crawling through dungeons is the best way of avoiding the mindless idiots that i tend to run into otherwise.

as for getting a life, maybe due to having a life i can't spend an hour or two straight in a group grinding out exp. maybe, there are things going on that require me to go afk for extended periods of time. think before you troll next time.

<a href=http://www.magelo.com/eq_view_profile.html?num=67354>Tempur Flarin</a> - The Maniac Monk
Vitam Aeternam

You want me to pull WHAT?
RETIRED