My in-guild post on the monk nerf

Dunno, maybe you'll find some points worth discussing. Anyway, here's what I posted to my guild.





First let me say that I agree monks should not be tanking uber mobs.



<blockquote>Quote:<hr> The only reason monks even caught up to warriors as far as "tankability" goes is cause our HP gap got smaller and smaller percentage wise.<hr></blockquote>



Close~





The only things that determines ability to tank uber mobs is raw hit points, and taunt factor. HP + taunt_factor = uber_mob_tanking_ability.





If you lack the HP, you will eventually get a max hit round, and die.



If you have the HP, the CH bridge will keep you alive no matter what.



On short fights (VE doing Vindi), you can get away with being a little short on the HP. But on the long fights against unslowable mobs, like Emp, or AoW, its flat-out impossible.







The nerf was (supposedly) aimed at monks tanking ubers, and it grossly failed at that goal. See above. Monks still have the same HP and the same taunt-factor. If Zyklan could tank Emp before, he can still do it.



Instead, the nerf severely damaged our abilities to pull, solo, and tank for an exp group.





Monks need their defensive skills to pull the uber mobs.



On the pull, we have to absorb punishment from these mobs, without heals. Of course we need good defense.





The correct way to adjust monks is to reduce the amount of aggro our damage generates on mobs level 58 and above.



That would eliminate our ability to tank uber mobs, but not damage our other abilities.



So kindly do me a favor. Think before you scream nerf. There are other ways to fix things than swinging a brick-bat.



Thank You.







(Yeah it would make evading easier, but reasonably skilled monks have no problem with that anyway (as long as the mob isn't rampage-bugged or something :P). Even with a mainhand weapon proccing Ensnare every 20 seconds, I can control aggro.)


Grazel Nukite, Grandmaster

Triage Quadbypass, Vicar of 60 Blueberries

Valiant Elite, Druzzil Ro

</p>

Finally, someone else sees my point. But i admit i never thought of lowering monk aggro. But i have been screaming nerf monk gear for awhile. Could you send me a link to that board?


<a href=http://www.magelo.com/eq_view_profile.html?num=139385>Sionistic Triplefist</a>

58 Monk

Veeshan
</p>

Its a private guild board.


Grazel Nukite, Grandmaster

Triage Quadbypass, Vicar of 60 Blueberries

Valiant Elite, Druzzil Ro

</p>

<font size="24">Well Said.</font>


-Korph




<a href="http://www.magelo.com/eq_view_profile.html?num=308735">http://gjband.com/Sig.jpg
Level 51 Disciple</a></p>

ok, shameless bump~ because I really want some feedback on the idea of lowering our damage aggro vs 58+ mobs.


Grazel Nukite, Grandmaster

Triage Quadbypass, Vicar of 60 Blueberries

Valiant Elite, Druzzil Ro

</p>

[Buhd]

Based on my understanding of game mechanics and I have to guess.



Monk Aggro/Hate is generated automatically by 'potential' output, each swing of your wep.



So for them to change the amount of Hate they could either:



Hardcode a new hate/aggro table for monks



or



Process a hate reduction amount, similar to how bane weps work for dmg.



or



Give monks an innate 'Jolt' proc.








Brotor Tiller
60 Monk
Rathe
League of Levity



<A HREF=http://www.magelo.com/eq_view_profile.html?num=153704>Brotor Tiller geeeeer</a></p>

[Kurrlee]

Very good post. I agree it is well said.



Like maybe a 'Jolt' proc on our flying kick??



Geee where I have heard that before??



The only problem I see is that Monks could still tank by never using Flying Kick.



Maybe a proc to our epic?




Kurrlee

Shackle Of Tynnonium</p>

see, if they did that then they wouldnt be anally raping us

then what would the point of VI's existance be?




</p>

i like being able to get aggro. if you dont want aggro...they nerfed ZERO of our abilities to manage aggro...use them



dont see what the problem is here.



if you get hit too much in exp groups, learn some techniques to fix it. dont need a handicap crutch like FK procing jolt heh



leave monk aggro as it is please~



southern


</p>

Kreuz, they arnt talking about aggro for exp groups. They are talking about lowering aggro so monks cant tank high end mobs. As stated before, all a high end tank needs is high taunt and high hp. Monks can get both, if you nerf the aggro factor, no more monk tank. But thats one thing thou, how would this effect exp groups.


<a href=http://www.magelo.com/eq_view_profile.html?num=139385>Sionistic Triplefist</a>

58 Monk

Veeshan
</p>

Nerfing monk aggro is short sighted.



What will happen is we will be able to maximise our damage on raids without fear of overaggroing, no matter if we go afk, no matter what weapons we use.



Don't you think rangers who must jolt and rogues who must evade would have good reason to cry foul?



Putting an uncontrolled jolt into flying kick is by the way the surest way to make monks unable to duo or play in small groups, no other class has a detaunt that fires at random making the mob spin on the druid or cleric healing you.



It also maximises our ability to do damage on raids without fear of ever pulling off of the main tank.



It would make us bad for xp groups (verant wouldn't mind that) and It would make us over powered in raids (Every other class would hate that).



It would be like making backstab have a random de-taunt proc, it would make us too easy to play in big encounters.






Sensei Belthos DeLint
The Defiant
http://www.magelo.com/eq_view_profile.html?num=21023 </p>

The real point is that Monks get hit like little sissies when we pull raid quality mobs now, thus nerfing our only unique contribution to raids. Without pulling we're simply gimp rogues.



I like the idea. Monks shouldn't be tanking in XP groups anyways. Put our defense back to the way it was pre-nerf and lower our taunt so that we can't tank, and Monks get back the 2 things most important to the class: raid pulling and soloing (to recover from raid deaths)



Chances of it happening: cha right <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/frown.gif ALT=":("> at this point the nerf is a fait accompli and VI has their fingers stuck in their ears singing "I can't hear you, I can't hear you"



On the plus side of this nerf: Battlefield 1942 is fooking awesome <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/smile.gif ALT=":)"> Not logging more than a couple times since the nerf has let me really get into it. Might be time to spend the cash for those 2 accounts on other recreational activities <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/smile.gif ALT=":)">







--

Stonetooth Sleestak

60 Iksar Monk

Druzzil Ro




</p>

ok, good at least Im getting some feedback now <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/wink.gif ALT=";)">





Belthos:

<blockquote>Quote:<hr> It also maximises our ability to do damage on raids without fear of ever pulling off of the main tank.<hr></blockquote>



It wouldn't take a large reduction in our aggro generation. 10% would be plenty to prevent us retaining aggro on ubers. That leaves lots of room for careless monks to get aggro.





Southern & Belthos : I think you missed a detail in my post : The aggro reduction would apply only to mobs level 58 or higher. Those aren't your average exp group mobs <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/wink.gif ALT=";)">




Grazel Nukite, Grandmaster

Triage Quadbypass, Vicar of 60 Blueberries

Valiant Elite, Druzzil Ro

</p>

i like to be able to get aggro on uber mobs...im not really interested in balancing eq for exp groups. you can exp with anyone and any class combo, so who cares really.



balance from the top down. start with raid style mobs, get that balanced so everyone has a useful contribution, then trickle the balancing down to exp groups and soloing. if the raid balance unbalanced soloing, go figure something else out for raid balance...its possible!



i like to stay #2 on aggro so i can /stonestance during transitions...the time between AE taunt and the ch order switching to the next tank is crucial...nice to have someone who can take some hits with a short disc and then FD



ask a bard how fun it is not to be able to aggro any mob...its not fun~



southern






</p>