*retitled: Before/After comparisons *colection*

Ok, first of all, before we have mass heart attacks, the log files appear to not be reporting double misses and so forth now. Yeay. No more sticky calcs.



There are about 3000 different opinion based threads. Keep posting elsewhere. If you feel that you solo'd my mom a lot easier than othertimes, thats fine but dont post it here.



If you DO have good, decent sized logs of before and after scenarios, please post them here! Lets try to collect it in one place.









Cuthul Paindancer lvl 60, 1267AC, ?? AAs vs Slaves in Nurga

Mitigation

Slash Damage ??

MIN: 26

MAX: 117

AVG: 60.92

Mitigation = 52.07% of Max



Avoidance

Total Attack Attempts: 1545

Hits: 641 (41.49%)

Misses: 510 (33.01%)

Blocks: 250 (16.18%)

Dodges: 75 (4.85%)

Riposte: 69 (4.47%)



DEFENSIVE DPS TAKEN: 19.57

-------------------------------------------



Mitigation

Slash Damage 40186

MIN: 30

MAX: 117

AVG: 66.87

Mitigation = 57.15% of Max



Avoidance

Total Attack Attempts: 1653

Hits: 692 (41.86%)

Misses: 596 (36.06%)

Blocks: 224 (13.55%)

Dodges: 75 (4.54%)

Riposte: 66 (3.99%)



DEFENSIVE DPS TAKEN: 19.35







So what do we see?





* Min/Max unchanged (26 from pre data was a stonestance)

* Average hit has gone up by 10%

* Hit % seems to be unchanged

* Miss % has gone up by 9%

* Block % has gone down by 16%

* Dodge % has gone down by 6%

* Riposte % has gone down by 11%

* DPS taken has remained unchanged



Conclusion.. From this data set, we take more on our hits but we seem to be missed more to compensate. Dodge and Riposte really have a smaller data set and it will be hard to really trust the decreaces we are seeing without correlating data. Block seems to be firing a lot less. 16% is pretty significant, even if with RNG.



I cant rationalize how we are not getting hit more, getting more per hit, but not taking more dps.



The block drop percentage is my largest concern. Miss very often is effected by AC. IE is it a form of mitigation. Ive seen warriors get missed more than myself. That will go away on mobs with higher attack values. Couple that with blocking less and we are much less viable on those encounters.



I haven read anyone elses data yet. This is a pretty blind analysis










Cuthul Paindancer

Master of the Path of Pain(Rodcet Nife)

Warlords of Wrath


Cuthul's Moderately Ok Gear (http://www.magelo.com/eq_view_profile.html?num=329174)


Culthul's Little Girl (http://www.magelo.com/eq_view_profile.html?num=182753)




" I've put up with being subpar damage wise because I was a fucking truck...now I'm just a little midget in a jeep with a pellet gun." --Sarthis</p>Edited by: <A HREF=http://pub35.ezboard.com/ucuthulpaindancer.showPublicProfile?language=EN>Cuthul Paindancer</A> at: 10/17/02 7:29:36 am

I think you got lucky with the blocks in the first sample. Just to add a few more number here.



Pre Nerf: Vs. Nobles in HHK.



Attacks: 9302

Misses: 3371 (36%)

Block: 1237 (13%)

Riposte: 368 (3%)

Dodge: 397 (4%)



% avoided: ~ 56 %





Total Damage: 200233



My average damage is a little messed up I think. Somehow I have 47.26 writeen down, but I remember it being signifigantly higher, i.e about 57. Pick whichever you like. =X

---------------------------------------------------



Post-Nerf in HHK



Number of Attacks: 1670

Misses: 639 (38%)

Blocks: 245 (14%)

Ripostes: 69 (4%)

Dodges: 73 (4%)



% Avoided: 61.4%



Total Damage 40774



Average Hit: 63.61





There might be a little poisoning in the little number from killing some other mobs (Like LDC's) but the VAST majority of those are the same HHK nobles.



I also noticed huge variances in both my DPS and the mobs I was fighting today. I have valleys with mobs DPS being as low as 8, and as high as 27. My DPS was anywhere from low 46 dps to high 73 dps versus identical mobs.



Is it possible that there has not been any real change in our functioning, but they're just doing a little smoke and mirrors with the random number generation?



I'd also like to add that I fought about 10 fights with no gear on but my CF's, and my Silver Shiverback hide sash and recieved almost identical DPS as with gear... With a low of 13 DPS and a high of 22.



Does anyone know if other classes are parseing too?

/speculation

Maybe they changed how they dice roll and have upped the other classes defenses so that they'll actuall be performing the same as before, while we're performing a little worse?

/speculation




</p>

[Junu Peeth]

M4dM0nk:



The AVG HIT from your pre nerf data was: 50.96



HITs = Total hits - (misses+dodge+block+riposte)



AVG HIT = Total Damage / HITs



Also note that your pre nerf Riposte % should be 4%.


Junu Peeth (http://www.magelo.com/eq_view_profile.html?num=157667), Grandmaster Human Monk on Mithaniel Marr

"I read the 1200+ monk nerf thread and lived!" (Got the T-Shirt too)</p>

Here's my parsed data. Not 1000s of attacks but still a decent sample.



pub35.ezboard.com/fmonkly...=373.topic (http://pub35.ezboard.com/fmonklybusiness43508frm17.showMessage?topicID=373. topic)



About 16% increase in damage taken



Latomi


</p>

Posting Junos conclusions:





-----------------------------







Junu Peeth lvl 60, 1082AC, no AAs vs Small Mushrooms

Mitigation

Hit Damage 17,232

MIN: 35

MAX: 126

AVG: 72.40

MODAL: 35 (21.43%)

DB: 30

DI: 4.8

AVG value of x: 8.83

Mitigation = 57.46% of Max



Avoidance

Total "Hit" Attempts: 576

Hits: 238 (41.32%)

Misses: 213 (36.98%)

Blocks: 74 (12.85%)

Dodges: 26 (4.51%)

Riposte: 25 (4.34%)



--------

AVG HIT

Pre: 67.62 Post: 72.40

7.07% Worse



% of Attacks that Missed

Pre: 33.95% Post: 36.98%

8.95% Better



AVG HIT per swing (Bottom Line - same as mob's DPS)

Pre: 28.73 Post: 29.92

4.14% Worse


</p>Edited by: <A HREF=http://pub35.ezboard.com/ucuthulpaindancer.showPublicProfile?language=EN>Cuthul Paindancer</A> at: 10/17/02 7:56:32 am

come on peeps, if you have a valid pre/post set of more than 20 fights put them up!


Cuthul Paindancer

Master of the Path of Pain(Rodcet Nife)

Warlords of Wrath


Cuthul's Moderately Ok Gear (http://www.magelo.com/eq_view_profile.html?num=329174)


Culthul's Little Girl (http://www.magelo.com/eq_view_profile.html?num=182753)




" I've put up with being subpar damage wise because I was a fucking truck...now I'm just a little midget in a jeep with a pellet gun." --Sarthis</p>

This is a 4.5 hour sample before patch, and a 3 hour sample after patch, I'm level 57, mobs are chardok zone-in mobs. I have 1035ac and 110agi (if that means anything, which I believe it does not.) and about 2000hps unbuffed.



First, my 'feelings'. The day before the patch, I solo'd the zone in. I had my cleric there for heals, but only healed once or twice mid-fight in the whole 4.5 hour data set. I Usually just CH'd myself between fights so there wasn't any downtime. Post patch, I was CHing myself @ the 50% point of most fights, and some I had to CH myself twice. I feel like i'm gitting hit harder, and more often.



Now the hard data:

prepatch underlined, post patch in bold:



A Chokidai Sniffer

Max Damage 138

Average Damage <u>77</u> 88

Odds of hitting ME <u>37.36%</u> 56.32



A Chokidai Whelp

Max Damage 117

Average Damage <u>61</u> 66

Odds of hitting ME <u>36.16%</u> 60.42%



A Di`Zok Recruit

Max Damage 138

Average Damage <u>72</u> 79

Odds of hitting ME <u>37.69%</u> 55.56%



A Di`Zok U

Max Damage 125

Average Damage <u>63</u> 81

Odds of hitting ME <u>35.27%</u> 67.74%



The double miss makes up for most of the difference in "odds of hitting ME", but I still felt like I got hit more often. It didn't feel like I was getting hit twice as often, but definatly more than I was before. (remember, thats a feeling, not fact, until I go through 4.5 hours of logs removing every other line, kthx verant, FU)



The increased damage is definatly significant though, at least to my lowAC and lowHP self. (Damn, I thought I was doing well to get over 1000, now I find out that most of you consider 'low' ac to be 1200!!!)



Fizmunk

57th monk

Tainted Twilight

Xegony... The Cesspool of Norrath


</p>

Prenerf log ....136 kills (Shrooms in FG)* * * * * * * *



Maximum Hit:126* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

Avrage Hit :59,90* * * * * * * * 47,54%* * * * * * * * * * * *

Minimum Hit :31* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *



Accuracy : 32,96%* * * * * * * * * * * *

Evasion : 47,08%* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

Defence : 19,97%

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

Hits :3016* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

Misses :4308* * * * * * * * * * * *

Blocks :1077* * * * 11,77%* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

Dodges :398* * * * 4,35%* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

Ripostes :352* * * * 3,85%* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

Amount of attacks :* 9151* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *







Postnerf log ....116 kills (Shrooms in FG)* * * * * * * *



Maximum Hit :126* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

Avrage Hit :64,71* * * * * * * * 51,36%* * * * * * * *

Minimum Hit :31* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *



Accuracy :29,91%* * * * * * *-3,05%* * * * * * * * * * * *

Evasion : 52,59%* * * * * * * * 5,51%* * * * * * * * * * * *

Defence : 17,50%* * * * * * * -2,47%* * * * * * * * * * * *



Hits :*2742* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

Misses :4821* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

Blocks :986* * * * 10,76%* * * * * * * * -1,01%

Dodges :313* * * * 3,41%* * * * * * * * -0,93%* * * * * * * *

Ripostes :305* * * * 3,33%* * * * * * * * -0,52%* * * * * * * *

Amount of attacks :*9167* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *



Added .... i take ruffly 15,16% dmg in a figh now then before nerf patch


<a target="new" href="http://www.magelo.com/eq_view_profile.html?num=211361">[60 Grandmaster] Rano
(Human)</a>

[60 High Priest] Datortek (Dwarf) (http://www.magelo.com/eq_view_profile.html?num=224710)

[54 Wanderer] Spee (Halfling) (http://www.magelo.com/eq_view_profile.html?num=349386)</p>Edited by: <A HREF=http://pub35.ezboard.com/udatortek.showPublicProfile?language=EN>Datortek</A> at: 10/18/02 2:39:22 am

looks like you actully get hit somewhere between 5-10% less (trying to correct for the double misses)


Frenzy Style

60 Drunken Grand Samurai Ninja Master

<a href=http://home.attbi.com/~eqmaximus/brell/ target=_blank> Brell Serilis
</a>

<A>
<a href="http://www.magelo.com/eq_view_profile.html?num=496" target="_blank">http://www.emotioneric.com/waferbaby_fusion.jpg
My Stuff </a>
<A>
<a href="http://www.magelo.com/eq_view_profile.html?num=27591" target="_blank">
Phrenzy Roxorz </a></p>

You do know you can just take the misses, dodeges, rips, etc and just divide them by 2, and recalc from there. (hits are ok in the old logs)


Cuthul Paindancer

Master of the Path of Pain(Rodcet Nife)

Warlords of Wrath


Cuthul's Moderately Ok Gear (http://www.magelo.com/eq_view_profile.html?num=329174)


Culthul's Little Girl (http://www.magelo.com/eq_view_profile.html?num=182753)




" I've put up with being subpar damage wise because I was a fucking truck...now I'm just a little midget in a jeep with a pellet gun." --Sarthis</p>

Just want to say that mitigation does not affect miss rate. Tests were done where someone dropped their ac to about 700 and they got smacked silly but the miss rate was exactly the same.



Next, if you are missed more your block percentage should go down an equivalent amount. Blocks/repostes/dodges only go off if the mob would have otherwise hit you. Thus if you parse before and CA and then after CA3 and PE your block % will go down by quite a lot.


</p>

[Junu Peeth]

Fizmunk, I have adjusted your pre patch data to account for the double miss bug:



Odds of hitting ME (pre nerf):

A Chokidai Sniffer 54.40%

A Chokidai Whelp 53.11%

A Di`Zok Recruit 54.75%

A Di`Zok U 52.15%


Junu Peeth (http://www.magelo.com/eq_view_profile.html?num=157667), Grandmaster Human Monk on Mithaniel Marr

"I read the 1200+ monk nerf thread and lived!" (Got the T-Shirt too)</p>