PDA

View Full Version : raiding monk discussion



Aggememnon
06-28-2012, 11:06 AM
Just wanted to garner some opinions...to ask what you guys think of the raiding monk at the moment in terms of:

a) raid dps (where you place on melee parses, whether your RLs put you in the 'dps grp' and if not who goes there)

b) raid role (mostly just dps I guess, but is there anything that uses a monk specifically in VoA for example?)

c) survivability (given a lot of classes have a fade/Fd, are you finding you are no longer the only class left standing on a wipe, measuring fps?)

d) class popularity (are you finding more of less monks logging on, or more of any particular class eg harder to get a fellow monk to stack synergy?)

e) intra class utility (are you happy with what you can do solo vs raid - eg do you think any deficit in say solo ability is compensated for in raid ability)

Gorkeyah
06-28-2012, 11:37 AM
a) dps: meh... in the top 10, but various other dps classes can beat us. Yes we get in dps groups

b) role: mostly dps.

c) survivability: monks and necros usually survive. SK's probably don't bail because they're tanks. However, beyond the FD issue, monk mend makes us good survivors also. Other DPS classes splat sooner, and if the group healer drops, monks can keep going because of mend better than others.

d) popularity: haven't noticed anything one way or the other. We're down a few from it being summer, but that's true of other classes also

e) utility: I'm happy though my dps has been stagnate for awhile because I'm maxed AA etc. However, I still have a weapon upgrade coming at least (t3 to t4). I wouldn't say we're the best solo or anything like that, but I don't find I'm stuck feeling jealous of some other class that can do something I can't.

Ughbash
06-28-2012, 12:22 PM
Just wanted to garner some opinions...to ask what you guys think of the raiding monk at the moment in terms of:

a) raid dps (where you place on melee parses, whether your RLs put you in the 'dps grp' and if not who goes there)

b) raid role (mostly just dps I guess, but is there anything that uses a monk specifically in VoA for example?)

c) survivability (given a lot of classes have a fade/Fd, are you finding you are no longer the only class left standing on a wipe, measuring fps?)

d) class popularity (are you finding more of less monks logging on, or more of any particular class eg harder to get a fellow monk to stack synergy?)

e) intra class utility (are you happy with what you can do solo vs raid - eg do you think any deficit in say solo ability is compensated for in raid ability)

A) Raid DPS we are beatable by Rangers, Necros, Wizards, Berserkers, and Rogues with that said I usually get a dps group and usually am in top 3... but that is because otehrs in oru riad force slack. Class wise we are near the top of the second third of classes in DPS and it should be pointed out that some of those classes bring more utility or raid dps as well as toping us in personal dps (Auspice, warcry etc).

B) DPS only. Now in CoB our force tethers wilo rather hten kites him. Monk is ideal for that due to mend and inpentrable and purify body. Still need a healer there for those oh shit moments, and it maeks it easier, but the healer is more for the backup tetherer then me. (Backup tetherer used when I get ported to roof).

c) Survivable... Relatively survivable, unfortuantely I also tend to be the tank of last resort so don't always get to play dead. For instance in Pillars (shadows) if we are short a SK I often get assigend to offtank the one add.

d) Not very many monks, but then I think that is a good thing for the raid force. If the only thing we bring is DPS and there are 5 classes who can bring more I can't see a reason to have a monk in the raid force.

e) Not happy with where monks are in the solo or group game either. I CAN tank T4 named, but a merc does it better. I CAN solo for AA (24 is my best lesson burn), though currnetly maxxed, but other classes also can do it much better. The one thing that makes me viable is the ability to make sure I only bring one to camp, because I can only tank one at a time. Slow and steady XP. Also some group missions are easy for a monk.... Stabbing, Illegal Mining, the various timed missons is sepluchur.

Overall I am Mr Doom and Gloom *chuckle* and not happy with being a monk

Rten
06-28-2012, 03:15 PM
In general I agree with the Ugh, but I would expand the thoughts...

A. I am pretty commonly in top 10, unless of course it is mob pingpong and then casters and rangers spank me. Overall DPS I agree that far more people *should* beat me, but they can be pretty slack.

B. DPS DPS DPS Backup Tank. If you are an AC whore monk, and you switch to 2hb (clearly taking you out of the DPS running), I can tank pretty damn well. Not hold agro well, but general ability to do it is nice. BUT, I have put a lot of effort into AC, and if you have not or are a more casual player, then tanking is not nearly as fun or safe.

C. We continue to be a very high chance of survival class.... but when raid mobs can hit 30k a pop and up, all it takes is the main tank dieing and I can splat before I can hit mend or FD. But overall, with purify, epic, mend, and common sense, I can survive a lot.

D. We have soso monk turn out, about normal to all classes. But I will use this section to put my 2 cents in about dps and us... there are 6 classes that can routinely out dps us (Zerk, Rog, Wiz, Beast, Ranger and Necro). Zerker imo sucks, they get HUGE dps, draw aggro, and bite the farm... I would hate to play one. Rogue's are great DPS and can own most dps lists, they are god at losing agro, but they cannot tank for crap... if you just want to be dps, then they own us, but I like being more versatle. Wiz are more dps but it is not my first choice... I just do not enjoy the lack of play style options, but they can do crazy dps. Beast can do sustained damage better than we can and are close to us in capabilities, but they take tons of AA to get there and they still cannot tank like we can... if it was a toss up between a mage and a monk, you would love a beast. Rangers can own us in dps, they can do it toe to toe or ranged, they have great raid utility, they can be backup healers or do CC, my guess is that we tank *SLIGHTLY* better with no discs running but in todays game they are a better all around toon to play. Necro is probably the most versatle class to play of the casters... insane dps, you have a pet, you can fd, I think Nec are the most interesting non melee class period. But ALL of this is just my opinion and every one of those classes probably has a grass is greener speach too!

E. Mercs have given all classes a lot of options. I personally have started 2 boxing with a mage. I tank, depending on mob I use a melee dps merc and a healer merc or 2 healer mercs. I let the pet go and have hot key chain nukes running. And keeping 2500-3k worth of ds on me makes a noticeable difference in fight length. I think my biggest *I miss* from the old days was having raid utility. The only thing on raids we tend to be are the under healed melee group since we can mend... and I *Loved* the old old days of pulling stuff like ToV or Plane of Fear or any of those old zones where if I screwed up I *definately* could die, and if it was bad enough I could wipe the raid. That challenge was FUN. Running around playing simon says for 2 hours and being a twitchy button masher to push up my DPS in Sep 5 is the OPPOSITE of fun.

Anyways those are my rambly thoughts for all they are worth.

Imuu
06-28-2012, 03:58 PM
Just wanted to garner some opinions...to ask what you guys think of the raiding monk at the moment in terms of:

a) raid dps (where you place on melee parses, whether your RLs put you in the 'dps grp' and if not who goes there)

b) raid role (mostly just dps I guess, but is there anything that uses a monk specifically in VoA for example?)

c) survivability (given a lot of classes have a fade/Fd, are you finding you are no longer the only class left standing on a wipe, measuring fps?)

d) class popularity (are you finding more of less monks logging on, or more of any particular class eg harder to get a fellow monk to stack synergy?)

e) intra class utility (are you happy with what you can do solo vs raid - eg do you think any deficit in say solo ability is compensated for in raid ability)

a) usually top 10 and rarelly get the 'dps' group as we dont have many bards. with even groups we should be beating rangers.

b) dps and occasionally tanking trash cause the tanks are lazy. lol

c) pretty much always monks and necros left after a raid, but there are a few of those raids with a stupid mechanic to stop that and everyone needs to get out of zone.

d) we'v got 5 monks on roster but only bout 2 maybe 3 have any decent RA at a time. rangers seem to be the most popular class in recent years fucking millions of them around.

e) what utility? groups ok but generally bores me. well geard can tank almost anything group wise. I know i would enjoy raiding much much more if i got a decent group more often, recently iv found it hard to log on to do sub par dps than i know i can with a good group, esp when all we can offer is dps.

twh583
07-02-2012, 10:12 AM
1) Zerks and necro generally dominate the parses, rangers and wizards are also in top5 and zerks tend to fall off the parse if the mob moves around a lot. For example Sarith - necros wizards and rangers generally do 8-11 mil dmg, with zerks/rogues/monks doing 4-8. I know of some rogues that can really drop bombs, but none are in my raid force so I haven't actually experienced that. My guild has 3 monks on the roster, plus 2 guys who just came back after a few months out, and 1 new recruit for a total of 6 monks recently. With that having been said, I've raided with 5 of the monks for 2+ years, and there are clear and distinct gaps in dps. I'm almost always top 3-5 in dps mixed competitively in with the zerks and rangers, while the other monks generally make spots 6-10.

2) DPS mostly. I know monks in my guild dream of the days of pulling, but those have long since passed. With moving mountains, I have attempted to utilize monks more often in regards to moving mobs around and splitting up large groups. However, I would say its an extremely limited ability to do so given we have no method to get aggro on a mob so they often just run to the nearest softy and smashes them. My guild also has some limitations on warriors, and so monks purposefully speed-bump tank if a tank drops and we pull aggro. Monks also actively tank adds in a few events, but that is more out of necessity than class ability - there are far more capable classes out there in virtually every area of specialty.

3) Survivability is pretty solid. Mend/defer death/impen/void body are all decent to great tools to stay up and fighting, while watching rogues, zerks and rangers die. I die less often than others. However, other classes survive pretty well on their own now - it is far from unique. Is our survivability to the degree to merit our lack of utility and average dps? No.

4) As I previously mentioned, my guild was averaging 2-3 monks for the last 3 months or so, and recently had 2 guys come back and 1 recruit, so are up to 4-6. However, I don't see much of a reason as to why someone would pick playing a monk over another class. The aspects to the monk class that used to make our class distinct, and drew me to it in the first place, have been passed around or eliminated from the game. We are basically bards, capable of doing a lot but none of it very well, and without the niche of massive ADPS (or just DPS) to make us desirable. This is a huge change to the class, as we used to be pretty good at a lot (Probably too many things), and in the process of 'balancing' us, we were basically cut off at the knees to only be mediocre at everything.

5) What I do in a raid is the exact same thing as what I do in a group. For me, there is no distinction, except maybe my parses look better vs a group mob and even then... only if I'm not grouped with one of the five other dps classes that kick ass better than we do. Pulling is fairly moot given that I am often taking or the primary source of dps in the group, and so if I'm pulling as well dps takes a dive. I find it often better just to have the chanter train herself or the warrior to run off and pull a few mobs while I tank up the last mob from his previous pull. While monks can pull moderately well, various things hurt us - for example the OOC req on echo - means we must wait for mobs to die or use ID. FD is far from useful in regards to pulling these days, it is more of an "oh crap I aggroed 10 mobs + a named" button. Moving mountains is neat... and while very useful and effective, it is primarily teamed up with ID, which has a 2 min refresh, and so we can MM+Fade every 2 mins. MM+FD is okay, but we're stuck laying down until aggro fades, and we need a tagger -- other classes capable of pulling are capable of pulling at slow to fast to insane-omg-we're-gonna-wipe speeds on their own. While we used to be the kings of pulling, we're more or less pawns now while bards are the queens (hah), and other classes are in between. Our ability to tank effectively is matched inversely with our ability to maintain stable aggro -- other classes sneeze near a mob and despite rogue aggro pots and whatever else, they can snap aggro away and we're helpless. On raids, while we can use MM to snatch the add from the MT, we have to hope someone else with an aggro tool gets on the mob before it lands or it will just run right back.

While I can't say I'd like to see us be better at everything (those days are long gone) I would like to be able to say "monks do xyz $#*@@ awesome-like". With the way raids are designed for the most part, dps seems to be the thing. I can't imagine much utility to bring to the class that couldn't be matched or beaten by another class only resulting in said utility being nerfed given our ability to ghetto-dps and ghetto-tank - the same being said for tanking really. It seems that we're either doomed to live a life as a middle ground class having fallen from supremacy or destined to give up a lot of ground in one area or another to gain ground in one area or another. However, it appears that such logic is lost on the devs and the playerbase at large.

Aggememnon
07-03-2012, 09:44 AM
As you can imagine, I've been thinking a lot about this, but wanted to give people a chance to respond before I present my own thoughts.

a) raid dps: On sustained parses (I'm not even gonna mention casters dps ;/), which I used to own, I am now seeing rogs being neck and neck or just ahead. Zerks are also there and there abouts. On burns around 1 min, its usually rogs>zerks>monks. IF others don't slack, you can intersperse beastlords and rangers also ahead of monks (and even paladins situationally). My best burn parse has been 71k, with rog best I saw 107k. Thats all down to Kolos. that means of course that the 'dps grp' now gets a beastlord with shaman and bard, remaining slots usually filled with zerks or rogs. Given that we do not have many active BL (1 usually), it means monks are now 95% of the time not in the dps group, while BL get an adps and dps role.

b)raid role: Just dps here really and leashing Wilo (though anyone can do that).

c) survivability: Over the past couple of years I have seen more and more classes left standing at the end of a wipe. I think all have a 'drop aggro' ability now? Monk survivability is often called a 'utility', but it seems many/all classes get that now. I have no complaints about that really, other than 'survivability' being counted against monks when balanced against their dps etc. I would say also that there are 2 things that make monks 'good' on this front. Impenetrable and 30 s mend.

d) class popularity: I'm seeing more rog and zerk applicants right now, and monk apps are a rarity. I think we had 1 in the past 2 years. Our regular turn out till recently was 2 high RA monks. One has main-changed now so I am pretty much alone. Not only is that bad for personal dps, but one of the few remaining joys of friendly rivalry has also gone with him. Looking at it logically, I really can't think of a good reason to bring a monk to a raid....

e)intra class utility: We often get called 'light tanks'. One of the arguments other classes make on our sub-par dps is that it is justified since we tank better than them. But really, its not significant enough an improvement to make us 'tanks'. I play better golf than my grandmother, but I don't go expecting to be in the US masters or anything. I think right now monks are pretty royally screwed. There is no raid role that needs a monk: The leashing of Wilo in CoB raid can use any class, since you need a healer there for those 'oh crap' moments. In group you *could* tank, but a merc is better. What else does a monk bring but sub-par dps? It seems to me that adps is playing a bigger and bigger role in the game, and we provide none, and benefit least from it. Its completely craptastic!


I'm honestly very unhappy with how badly monks have been overlooked recently. It seems there is no balance between role/utility/dps anymore, and lots of classes are benefiting from that. Except monks, who get tethered with 'light tank' and 'pulling' and 'survivability' as a role, while there are classes much better at any of those, who keep gaining more...

What compounds the matter is that there is now a CRT 'team' which discusses in game issues (such as balance I guess), and guess what? No monk. And would you expect any of the other classes to bring up monk issues? I doubt it. And would you expect devs to notice? I doubt they even know there is a monk class anymore.

Anyway, I'm pretty annoyed. I guess I can take the doom and gloom crown from Ughbash..

Ughbash
07-03-2012, 11:38 AM
Anyway, I'm pretty annoyed. I guess I can take the doom and gloom crown from Ughbash..

Back off Agg, My crown. I've been preaching it since TBS when rangers got boosted to same overcap mitigation as us (combined with a higher ac and soft cap chain vs leather).

As you said there is 0 reason for a monk in a raid force.

tanecho
07-04-2012, 02:37 PM
a) When I get placed with a DPS group (of which there are 1-3 depending on bard attendance) I'm usually top 5. When I'm not, I struggle to break top 10. We seem to be very reliant on the bard due to the interactions of overhaste and hundredhand effects. This is painfully ironic when you consider that we provide no tangible benefit to our group in terms of damage.

b) My raid role is DPS, and pulling when appropriate. We don't have reliable agro tools, so we can't really serve as tanks.

c) Survivability is really where we shine, but what does it matter when your presence isn't a huge benefit in the first place? I have a lot of tools to drop agro, restore health, and protect myself.

d) For popularity, I just came back recently, and joined a guild that was looking for monks. It was because they only had one. When they added me as a 2nd, they closed recruitment on them. I can't think of any other class where a guild would be happy with 2.

e) I think we're a pretty strong solo class, and a pretty weak raid class. I would gladly give up some of the things that make us so great at AA grinding (and everyone knows what I'm talking about here) for more usefulness to a group/raid. Making infusion of thunder a group buff instead of self only would be a good start for this.

Kajok
07-04-2012, 03:42 PM
The only event rangers beat me on is event 2 sep b/cof the push. If rangers are beating you on parses it's you not the class.

Ughbash
07-04-2012, 03:53 PM
The only event rangers beat me on is event 2 sep b/cof the push. If rangers are beating you on parses it's you not the class.

Kajok, Right now I am open to the possiblilty I am not doing my best dps. Currnetly one ranger regularly beats me and he is regularly top dps (I usualy am number 2 or 3 though I think it is because others slack).

Question for you are your rangers in the same group as you?

Don't take offense at this, you and I do not exactly get along, but could your rangers be under performing? I'm not the only one who mentioned rangers.

Here is the only HIGH end parse I have seen... It might have been your guild.



'/GU Herald of Oratory in 49s, 86192k @1759024dps --- Rogue 5103k @108569dps (5.92&PCT;) --- Rogue 4859k @101229dps (5.64&PCT;) --- Rogue 4627k @98456dps (5.37&PCT;) --- Zerker 4265k @90740dps (4.95&PCT;) --- Zerker 4194k @89237dps (4.87&PCT;) --- Zerker 4050k @88040dps (4.7&PCT;) --- Monk pets 3931k @83647dps (4.56&PCT;) --- Paladin 3860k @82131dps (4.48&PCT;) --- Ranger 3700k @84091dps (4.29&PCT;) --- Ranger 3667k @83343dps (4.25&PCT;)'

One ranger was higher DPS then the monk however less total damage looks like he attacked late. And while in a DPS group even the paladin was comparable to a monk. And that looks to be almost a perfect time for a monk where rangers get 3 min of awesome with their main disc.

Edit: Nope was RoI not Machin Shin so not your guild.

Gorkeyah
07-04-2012, 09:41 PM
No class in my guild gets numbers like that. (We just started on sep raids.) Not sure what we are missing. Highest I recall seeing is maybe 70's. I'm still usually in the 50's.

twh583
07-04-2012, 09:44 PM
Ugh, there is a mess of bad a$$ rangers on our server sadly. From what I've seen over the past few years it depends a lot on the event and push, as Kajok suggested. My guild has the occasional absurdly outrageous push and on those events rangers will obliterate me. However, on other events where push is less or not a factor at all I'll crush them.

It bothers me though that now folks say our defensive/survivability factors into balancing our dps, while during beta, even folks among our class argue the exact opposite.

When it comes time for aa suggestions and such as a class we are all over the place with requests ranging from cure-mends to invis to more run speed. All the while such dissonance among our requests results in less targeted ideas. We could toss this up to a lack of a monk crt, but I have my doubts that even that would allow for us to gain ground. As a class we have almost no identity and as such our requests attempt to define us, but come from all angles and is often chaotic.

Truthfully though, I don't imagine dps ever being truly balanced in EQ. There is a serious lack of creative mechanics for mobs. The occasional increased spell resistance or whatever is about all one can expect. While if devs were more creative with mechanics they could balance all dps evenly, and then let the mobs determine who excels with mechanics like critical hit/nuke weakness/resistance or even a two-sided mob making backstab impossible. Or low and behold making the armor worn matter! So while plate might deflect slashing and piercing, it would be susceptible to blunt/h2h or whatever. Or hell, even ae's which block random effects like % dmg mods or hhe would alter dps dynamics a lot. And all of this goes without stating the fact that some mechanics should have been applied to weapons/spells vs characters, such as crits. Like wizards get xyz nuke of fiery doom which has a +9% chance to crit, while most of their spells have a +0% chance. It would allow for the increase to such things to be more transient and situational. Balance would follow in that if wizards get the most spells with + crit chance and spells covering a wider range of resists, than mages could get more spells with higher base damage. As such balance mechanics could translate to melees fairly well - and would make dpsing a tad less monotonous if we had to factor in such things and carry around multiple weapons with various quirks to maximize dps. While the quirks + base dps (being balanced) would result in one or two classes shining, but only against xyz event or xyz mob in abc zone.

A truly pointless rant, but I do feel better now. At times the age of EQ begins to grate on me - and the constant response of "we cant do X b/c of the age of X and it was coded like a dinosaur" just pisses me off.

Gorkeyah
07-04-2012, 09:53 PM
They did that with pillars and made bards dps kings, while monks either are meh or sucky for dps and in some places having a tanking bonus. Heh

twh583
07-05-2012, 12:13 AM
Yeah, pillars is about the best example of "good mechanics". Although one could argue that given the current imbalance among classes, the "good mechanics" simply make the situation worse.

Aggememnon
07-05-2012, 06:00 AM
Kajok - I'd be interested to hear your take on the other points I mentioned...
(Ned - why did you quit again? Pm me)

Ughbash
07-05-2012, 10:09 AM
Kajok - I'd be interested to hear your take on the other points I mentioned...
(Ned - why did you quit again? Pm me)

I think he quit again because he was banned from the EQ boards for posting Beta stuff in non beta areas.

Kelefane
07-05-2012, 12:18 PM
Ive been banned from the EQ boards for months.

Those fags are quick to swing ban sticks at anyone making a post that even smells like anti SOE.

Rten
07-05-2012, 01:36 PM
There are so many variables that go into a good (high) raid mob parse.... group composition, is the toon in your group a good player, are AoEs of beneficial things happening. Silly example is old Rubak run, *yes* we have a sham in our group... but he is tasked with slowing all the mobs and does not think to click epic before running off to do that. Also as you all know, for an outstanding parse we are very dependant on a good crane kick... which is totally freaking random. When crane is 60K to 600K dmg on a 30 sec fight (for easy math), you are talking it alone accounting for 2k to 20k DPS... at the high end and you are in the top 10, at the low end you can look like a slacker. And if the /rng decides you are going to suck today... there is nothing you can do to change it. The fact that we need 4+ hour parses to start to stabilize dps shows just how streaky it can be for everyone.

Net result is that while the eye candy of top 10 is fun, any one or even any 10 40sec parses do not show crap. Our ability to deliver high end consistent top 10 DPS is meh at best... and we have 0 raid benefit while being meh.

Nedrom
07-06-2012, 12:22 PM
There are so many variables that go into a good (high) raid mob parse.... group composition, is the toon in your group a good player, are AoEs of beneficial things happening. Silly example is old Rubak run, *yes* we have a sham in our group... but he is tasked with slowing all the mobs and does not think to click epic before running off to do that. Also as you all know, for an outstanding parse we are very dependant on a good crane kick... which is totally freaking random. When crane is 60K to 600K dmg on a 30 sec fight (for easy math), you are talking it alone accounting for 2k to 20k DPS... at the high end and you are in the top 10, at the low end you can look like a slacker. And if the /rng decides you are going to suck today... there is nothing you can do to change it. The fact that we need 4+ hour parses to start to stabilize dps shows just how streaky it can be for everyone.

Net result is that while the eye candy of top 10 is fun, any one or even any 10 40sec parses do not show crap. Our ability to deliver high end consistent top 10 DPS is meh at best... and we have 0 raid benefit while being meh.

I just despise parse mobs.

Button mashing timing & order. That along can kill your dps.

Nedrom
07-06-2012, 12:26 PM
I think he quit again because he was banned from the EQ boards for posting Beta stuff in non beta areas.

False.

I was banned for asking for feedback about things that were broken in the beta. Someone went crazy deleting a lot of my posts saying I was inciting personal attacks against the devs, which was far from the truth.

I used to be a mod (Xerxes, if anyone remembers), and I'm still a moderator for these forums here at MB, I think I would know what a personal attack was or wasn't.

Anyway, turns out because I was complaining about this or that not working, they didn't like that, so they banned me and I was also banned from playing the game, so I dropped my app to Triality and canceled my subscription.

I came back (in March) and built a new monk (my 3rd) under a new F2P account on Maelin.

Nedrom
07-06-2012, 12:30 PM
Ive been banned from the EQ boards for months.

Those fags are quick to swing ban sticks at anyone making a post that even smells like anti SOE.

Yup, the EQLive boards is quite a small community and with any real lack of ownership comes lack of reliable moderation. Believe me, I took my complaints all the way up with Piestro and had quite a few emails back and forth about my banning and they told me after I got banned they said they would look into changing their policies but I doubt that ever happened.

Mris
07-07-2012, 12:05 AM
Ive been banned from the EQ boards for months.

Those fags are quick to swing ban sticks at anyone making a post that even smells like anti SOE.

I swear the mods have a quota they have to reach each week. The number of perfectly valid and respectful threads that get locked for being "non-constructive", or get "moved" to God knows where for being in the wrong section (tradeskills in the tradeskill forum? SIN!), and the link the mod puts up is broken, or can't be viewed because you account isn't qualified, is just terrible.

I think the best is when you get a topic that gets locked, the mod says, use this topic instead, go to that topic, it sends to you another, and that one is locked, or so old that it gets locked instantly for posting in old threads. *sigh*

Ughbash
07-07-2012, 11:32 AM
False.

I was banned for asking for feedback about things that were broken in the beta. Someone went crazy deleting a lot of my posts saying I was inciting personal attacks against the devs, which was far from the truth.


OK, one question. Were you asking for stuff about beta in Beta boards or on regular boards. It does make a differnce. If you were asking on beta baords they should not have done anything.

Nedrom
07-07-2012, 05:14 PM
Beta.

Kaliaila
07-15-2012, 04:25 AM
The mods aren't any better, in fact they are worse. If you go back and look in the forums leading up and after the time that we went F2P, there are tons of threads which were about very specific and major issues that people brought up and were locked and redirected everyone to the huge and bloated F2P announcement thread. Just about every issue that came about in the first 2 months of F2P was brought up in at least one of these threads as well as the main one, but mostly because the specific thread locked almost instantly the problems were lost in the shuffle. Though I'm sure some they just ignored.

Aggememnon
08-08-2012, 08:06 AM
In case noone saw this link on SoE forums, its worth a read and comment:
http://forums.station.sony.com/eq/posts/list.m?topic_id=187493

Rten
08-08-2012, 06:25 PM
This is my reply to the thread you linked:

************

I hope Devs or other interested people read some of the monk boards. As a monk who has played a long time and been willing to parse long hours of boredom to prove or disprove our theories, I am fairly firm in my opinions as they are based in parse-able fact.

1. Main issue in my opinion: That an intelligent person making a group or a raid has no reason to include a monk if other classes are available.

I believe this to be true when we have super limited group benefits and our role as DPS is routinely beaten by other melee (no value judgment on the others). So if I am putting together a Raid, and I have slots for 12 dps melee, it is in the raids best interest to have me pick the best melee for the job.



How you address this can be the “current” plan of attrition of player base. It seems lately that Sony has decided the way to make all classes valuable is to have so few people playing that you take whoever shows up! Thus since I logged in, and fewer and fewer people are logging in… I am “Wanted”. And to a certain extent this is true. But as a long range strategy it seems pretty poor.



If you agree with my base issue, then we fall into how to address it. Pragmatic issue #1: Sony is not going to rewrite the game to be a balanced thoughtful everyone adds value game. Pragmatic Issue #2: no answer likely to be considered can take very much developer time to implement. We all want new content, and we want them to fix the issues that are just flat bugs, so I am trying to accept that whatever solution is proposed and hopefully adopted, can be implemented easily. This leads us to suggestions which are Band-Aids. And Pragmatic Issue #3: my Band-Aid cannot screw up or make another players character actively worse/useless. 3 is the toughie… when we all compare ourselves to each other, it is Very hard to come up with suggestions that make me more useful without by edging into the territory of some other toon.



So to me it boils down to 2 focuses: #1 What do I enjoy doing in EQ and #2 what do other EQ players value me for doing. As of this, I *believe* other EQ players only value Monks for DPS. And if you look at what monks seem to have enjoyed from recent expansions, the Eye Candy of Crane Kicks and Moving Mountains are pretty uniformly liked (not everyone but most players). So to me it comes down to something situational that increases our damage or allows us to sustain what we can currently do for longer, are the likely suspects. The current top 3 discs for monk DPS are Speed Focus, diamond palm, and inner flame/Crane. Increasing the duration of the first 2 or making any of the 3 of them available more frequently will improve our DPS and in theory desirability. And since they are already in game, seem simple coding changes to accomplish.



I like the creativity of some of the proposed options for ways to help our class recover, but I think we are getting bogged down in the details. You can agree or disagree with any of my opinions, but in general having played since 99, I am pretty comfortable that they are all true. And as a long term player I know it is easier to shoot down ideas then it is to propose good ones. If you do not agree with me, or if you would like to see any of the many parses I have posted or have stored, feel free to PM me.

Imuu
08-09-2012, 02:57 PM
I see a few posts going on bout casters being unhappy being so far behind melee on burns. I dont understand this.

I'v seen Zerk's, Rog's and Wizzys hit 100k dps on burns and in my eyes those are the top dps classes.

Mage, ranger, monk, beast all seem to be a good portion behind. but i dont see why any other of the other casters are moaning? Necros are always top on long fights hands down.

In my eyes we should be noticably between Z,R,W and the rest.

I wanted to make a post up on the eq boards but i cant remeber my password lol

Kelefane
08-09-2012, 07:06 PM
I'v seen Zerk's, Rog's and Wizzys hit 100k dps on burns and in my eyes those are the top dps classes.

You must not have seen a good Necro then. Necros smoke Wizards.

Aggememnon
08-10-2012, 08:16 AM
I find it quite disgusting that there is still no monk on the CRT.

Tayken Mytime
08-10-2012, 08:25 AM
The only event rangers beat me on is event 2 sep b/cof the push. If rangers are beating you on parses it's you not the class.

what push

;p~

Imuu
08-10-2012, 10:43 AM
You must not have seen a good Necro then. Necros smoke Wizards.

They rarely post there parses in our guild apart from on long events.

On normal parses they arent on it cause its done by a melee and they dont get the necros spells etc.

Mendler
08-10-2012, 12:52 PM
Yeah a well played nec owns. The short burst fights they will still suffer slightly but over all nec dps is nice.